Late model 440 build

[Cookcharger]

Hey guys, i'm new to the site, but so far your post have been helpful, so i ask some help again.
I am restoring a 73 SE, i have a 78 440 that came with the car that i want to put in it (for now).
I'd like to get 500hp out of it, any suggestions on budget build for this would be awsome, i have a 440 wedge motor
too but that is going to get a 1000+ hp treatment later on down the road.  I'm just trying to get the late model 440 going to get it on the road,
so pls any info on a budget build for 500hp would be awesome.

Thanks

[c00nhunterjoe]

What is the dollar figure in your budget?

[BSB67]

Hey guys, i'm new to the site, but so far your post have been helpful, so i ask some help again.
I am restoring a 73 SE, i have a 78 440 that came with the car that i want to put in it (for now).
I'd like to get 500hp out of it, any suggestions on budget build for this would be awsome, i have a 440 wedge motor
too but that is going to get a 1000+ hp treatment later on down the road.  I'm just trying to get the late model 440 going to get it on the road,
so pls any info on a budget build for 500hp would be awesome.

Thanks

1) All 440s are wedge motors
2) Don't bother saving you "wedge" for the 1000 hp deal, the block will not go there.
3) Need your budget, and what parts you have available.

[Cookcharger]

Well that sucks, I thought the block walls of the 440's were thick enough for a 1000.
That's bad news, any ways I have a budget of about 5 grand, hoping that's enough to get the first motor going with the horses I want.  I don't currently have anything other than a bone stock 440.

[BSB67]

Well that sucks, I thought the block walls of the 440's were thick enough for a 1000.
That's bad news, any ways I have a budget of about 5 grand, hoping that's enough to get the first motor going with the horses I want.  I don't currently have anything other than a bone stock 440.

Is 5 grand the all in number?  Just a Long block?  Does the engine run now?

Do you have:
Exhaust system?
Headers?  hp manifolds?
Torque converter?
A good sure grip?  what gear?
A hp intake - what is it?
A hp carb - what is it?
Ignition?
Valve train?
Oil pan? windage tray? oil pump? intermediate shaft?

Are these in the $5,000?

How far in the hole are the pistons?

[Cookcharger]

No it doesn't run now, I was given three motors when I purchased the car. None were in it or running, but everything I have is all stock original.  I got a numbers matching 400, and two 440's one 78 and a 74.  I also have a numbers matching 4 speed torque flight trans with the 400.  No intake or carbs, I was wanting to go with a 6 pack set up, and a 410 geared dana 60 but other than that idk, kinda why I asked for opinions, I have a decent know how with cars but this is new territory for me.

But I appreciate any and all thoughts so ty BSB67.  

[BSB67]

No it doesn't run now, I was given three motors when I purchased the car. None were in it or running, but everything I have is all stock original.  I got a numbers matching 400, and two 440's one 78 and a 74.  I also have a numbers matching 4 speed torque flight trans with the 400.  No intake or carbs, I was wanting to go with a 6 pack set up, and a 410 geared dana 60 but other than that idk, kinda why I asked for opinions, I have a decent know how with cars but this is new territory for me.

But I appreciate any and all thoughts so ty BSB67.  

You should try to answer all of the questions.  Here are the questions you have not answered yet:


Is 5 grand the all in number?  Just a Long block?  

Do you have:
Torque converter?
A good sure grip?  what gear?
Ignition

How far in the hole are the pistons?


The six pack and the rear end that you want are over $3000.  Is that part of your $5000 or outside that?


Alright, I'm already starting to get exhausted.  So I'll skip ahead.

For the motor alone, if you want to re-do the short block (i.e. new pistons) you cant get there with $5000.  Even on a motor alone budget.

Cheapest path to some performance:
1) Take the better short block, hone, and new bearings and rings.
2) spend $3500 on aluminum heads (either cheap ones and have them reworked, or the soon to be released TrickFlow), solid cam, and valvetrain
3) Buy carb and intake off ebay. and the cheapest headers you can find.

This will be about a $5000 deal.  Your compression will be low (how low will depend if your pistons are 0.150" or 0.090" below the deck) and you won't have 500 hp.  It can run pretty good though.


Next cheapest
All of the above, plus
Buy std bore 2355 pistons, have the block honed round to a 0.005" clearance (if possible and if you can find a shop to do it) file fit rings.
Buy someone's rebuilt rods and good bolts off ebay (they do pop up time to time and you can get them for cheap)

You can get to 500 hp with this.  But certain things will need to line up, You'll need to know what you are doing, and you'll have a hard time getting a reputable machine shop to do this for you unless they know you and trust that you know what you are doing.

Next cheapest, and more likely
All of the above plus:
2355 pistons +0.030", bore, hone
You could do the rod deal above, but now that you actually put money into the short block, you might want to put the pistons on new rods.

Same power as above.  More money, but probably easier to get done by a novice.


This is really the best way of doing it on a budget.  Trying to split $5000 between the heads/induction and a rebuilt short block you end up with junk top to bottom.  For the same amount of money, you will make way more power, have a very good upper half of the motor that you will use for years to come on future bottom ends.  And if the bottom end craps the bed, you have not plowed much money into it.

[1974dodgecharger]

WHAT BSB67 SAIDS....or do a roadkill style pull a 440 out of a 70 to 72 motorhome add, heads, headers, intake, and you will have 400 plus to wheels so that equates to 500 plus HP for sure.....

if starting from stratch it gets expensive.....new pistons, crank, rods, heads, bell housing, flywheel etc...

[c00nhunterjoe]

How long do you want it to last? Sure, yank a junkyard motor out and slap it in. But its not going to run forever. But with the budget you have laid out, that is looking like your only option, and its really not even enough to do a junkyard build thats going to run very long problem free.
   It sounds like you need to inspect all of the engines you have sitting there and see which one has the bottom end in the best shape. Hone that block, slap a set of rings and bearings in it. Then buy a big cam and lifters and slap that in. Pick whichever heads have the valves seated the best and throw them on your "fresh" bottom end. You can get a set of 120 dollar hedman headers for it and an intake used in the 150 range. Slap whatever 750 carb your remaining budget can purchase used.
    I have no clue where to start on your origonal 4 speed automatic torqueflight. That should be put on a shelf in a museum. Try and find a trans and converter on craiglist. They pop up in my area around 850 to 1000 for retired race car trans's.
   For the rear, ebay or craiglist again for an 8 3/4 pumpkin. Usually 400-600 bucks.

In total, you have slapped together a mess that will.probably sound cool, run ok, and burn some oil. You have spent all of the alloted budget with maybee enough leftover for a tank of gas. Good luck and be sure to take pictures.

[Cookcharger]

Thanks you cOOnhunterjoe, very helpful, i don't have an overall budget was just ball parking that figure, i am doing a ground up rebuild so i have a lot to do and buy so 5 grand isn't going to get me anything special i know, and its not a final budget.  what i was initially asking was what it was going to cost to rebuild my 440 with 500 or so horses, the "budget" was just tossed out there.  I am slowly building this car and buying things as i go with money i do have.  Trying to enjoy building my dream car, restore the body to show quality, with a few custom styles that i like, and making it fast and loud.  Thank you for the positive post and helpful info. 

[c00nhunterjoe]

Thanks you cOOnhunterjoe, very helpful, i don't have an overall budget was just ball parking that figure, i am doing a ground up rebuild so i have a lot to do and buy so 5 grand isn't going to get me anything special i know, and its not a final budget.  what i was initially asking was what it was going to cost to rebuild my 440 with 500 or so horses, the "budget" was just tossed out there.  I am slowly building this car and buying things as i go with money i do have.  Trying to enjoy building my dream car, restore the body to show quality, with a few custom styles that i like, and making it fast and loud.  Thank you for the positive post and helpful info. 

Starting with a bare block, start to finish, figure on 10k. Rotating assembly is about 2000, heads are about 2000, 250 for an intake. 600 for a carb, figure on 400 for the incedentals such as gasket kit, bolts, oil pump, etc. 600 for a good set of rockers, headers are anywhere from 150 to 1000 depending on what you want. So you can see how quick it adds up and we havnt even factored in the machine work amd assembly.....

[68CoronetRT]

I have a 78' 440 block. I'm running the stock crank/rods(Cast) and speedpro pistons. I had the bottom end assembled when I started my build(It had bad bearings, but still together). Came with the Cam, water pump, PS pump, carb, Dist. I did the 440Source heads with 10* Locks/retainers, Lunati Lifters, Smith Brothers Push Rods, Holley Single Plane Intake, Crane Iron Ductile Rockers. It was my version of a "budget" and it was around 4,500$ all set and done. It needs a solid lift cam to really wake the motor up(And port work), but I wanted a streetable 4 speed car so we kept the cam which is hydrolic and somewhat mild.

Looking back I would probably have done the 512 stroker kit to get rid of the cast bottom end and go with a larger cam. But so far I have roughly 4k miles on the build and it runs awesome(Thanks to Ron!!). That's my 

[1974dodgecharger]

what coonhunter said also  mine from bare block was 8k and that was using a old carb lying around so that was free....

[myk]

Spend the money on the headers too.  It's worth it....

[teddy1500]

If you are going to do it, do it once. Take the time to put the best parts you can afford into the short block. But understand that that using the stock heads is going to cost some power, for now. You can always update with better heads and intake later. Get the mopar performance engine book. read from cover to cover. Get the chassis book, read it too. some where with in these 2 books you will find the performance recipes, take it all is, and figure out what you are looking for, then follow the directions. there is more to a hot car than motor.