stock power steering

Hard Charger · May 10, 2015, 06:52:15 PM

just completed a 4 year restoration. immediately buying the car I decided power steering was needed so I started to buy parts for the change over.

first I bought a rebuilt steering box and it sat on a shelf for years. everything went well with the installation. all the correct parts right from the beginning. it sure is nice having the power steering.

the problem is you cannot feel the tires. its almost to smooth. is there a way to tighten a stock power steering box like the manual box with the lash screw adjustment?

c00nhunterjoe · May 10, 2015, 07:50:55 PM

No, but if you have a saginaw pump, its easy to remove the regulator and shim it to lower the pressure. I did it to mine and dramatically improved road feel from the "pinky finger" stock steering.

myk · May 10, 2015, 09:44:14 PM

That's the old Mopar over-boosted power steering for you. You can try what 'Coon suggested, or you can buy a FIrm Feel steering box that gives a more firm steering wheel...

c00nhunterjoe · May 11, 2015, 05:52:52 AM

Not to take anything from firm feel cause i love them, but my method cost about 10 minutes of your time, and a bottle of steering fluid.

PlainfieldCharger · May 11, 2015, 07:33:10 AM

Quote from: c00nhunterjoe on May 11, 2015, 05:52:52 AM
Not to take anything from firm feel cause i love them, but my method cost about 10 minutes of your time, and a bottle of steering fluid.

Do you have any more details on the shim method? what thickness? shim material? Sounds interesting...

toocheaptosmoke · May 11, 2015, 11:31:22 AM

http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf

Been planning on doing this for a while, might have to try it this week.

PlainfieldCharger · May 11, 2015, 11:41:01 AM

Quote from: toocheaptosmoke on May 11, 2015, 11:31:22 AM
http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf

Been planning on doing this for a while, might have to try it this week.

Nice!! thanks for posting....

Hard Charger · May 11, 2015, 05:11:53 PM

nice remedy. great information.

myk · May 12, 2015, 04:37:04 AM

Quote from: c00nhunterjoe on May 11, 2015, 05:52:52 AM
Not to take anything from firm feel cause i love them, but my method cost about 10 minutes of your time, and a bottle of steering fluid.

Will that give the same result as a modified steering box? I'd rather not spend the $500 if I dont have to...

c00nhunterjoe · May 12, 2015, 05:24:54 AM

Great article. That pretty much sums up what i did. Ive never driven a firm feel box, but i can say that my steering is pretty close to my 2007 charger. Very stable and great road feel. No more over boosted steering.

myk · May 12, 2015, 09:11:41 AM

Quote from: c00nhunterjoe on May 12, 2015, 05:24:54 AM
Great article. That pretty much sums up what i did. Ive never driven a firm feel box, but i can say that my steering is pretty close to my 2007 charger. Very stable and great road feel. No more over boosted steering.

Now that's quite a statement...

c00nhunterjoe · May 12, 2015, 02:22:29 PM

Quote from: myk on May 12, 2015, 09:11:41 AM
Quote from: c00nhunterjoe on May 12, 2015, 05:24:54 AM
Great article. That pretty much sums up what i did. Ive never driven a firm feel box, but i can say that my steering is pretty close to my 2007 charger. Very stable and great road feel. No more over boosted steering.

Now that's quite a statement...

If you lived closer i would let you try it.

toocheaptosmoke · May 12, 2015, 09:11:27 PM

Just did mine this evening, coonhunterjoe is right, it really does make it feel more normal! Before I could turn the wheel just a half inch to either side and the car would start drifting that way, with no feedback through the wheel. Now, there's more of a centered feel and some road feedback. Wind was gusting 20-30 mph tonight and before I would have been all over the road. Took a couple miles to get the air out of the system because I didn't bleed it right, then things settled in. I just have a cheap stock reman gear.

myk · May 13, 2015, 08:37:30 AM

See I'm starting to think I may not need a Firm Feel or a Borgeson box to tighten up the steering. With my Hotchkis installed suspension and the fast ratio parts, the car is getting closer to "satisfactory" in the steering feel department. If the low pressure 'mod works, I may not need a modified steering box...

c00nhunterjoe · May 13, 2015, 08:40:18 AM

As long as your box is not wore out and loose, dropping the pressure is a drastic change. Changing the pressure will not help if your box is shot.

myk · May 13, 2015, 08:41:49 AM

Yeah I've got 40K on this box. It's still worth a shot though, since it doesn't cost anything anyway.

Quote from: toocheaptosmoke on May 12, 2015, 09:11:27 PM
Just did mine this evening, coonhunterjoe is right, it really does make it feel more normal! Before I could turn the wheel just a half inch to either side and the car would start drifting that way, with no feedback through the wheel. Now, there's more of a centered feel and some road feedback. Wind was gusting 20-30 mph tonight and before I would have been all over the road. Took a couple miles to get the air out of the system because I didn't bleed it right, then things settled in. I just have a cheap stock reman gear.

So what size washers did you go with? The ones in the article? Did you have to remove your pump?

c00nhunterjoe · May 13, 2015, 11:26:55 AM

You dont have to remove the pump. Just pop the pressure line off, then unscrew the regulator from the resevoir. I dont remember what i used, i rooted through my toolbox until i found washers that were close in diameter so i wouldnt have to trim as much. I ended up pulling mine out twice. The 1st time made it feel pretty good but i wanted more so popped the regulator out and added another washer.

myk · May 14, 2015, 03:15:32 AM

Ok thanks. I figure I'll buy a half-inch OD washer and just drill it to 3/8ths.

So to clarify, you remove the valve, take the valve apart, install a shim (or two, or three?), reinstall and refill?

toocheaptosmoke · May 14, 2015, 11:25:18 AM

Yup. There were no shims at all installed on my valve. I put a 1/16" thick copper brake line washer in mine, just what I had laying around. It was 3/8" I.D. so I clamped it between two nuts on a 3/8" bolt, then turned it down with a bench grinder. Ground the nuts down with it, was easier than trying to drill a 3/8" hole in a 1/2" O.D. washer.

myk · May 14, 2015, 05:24:00 PM

I didn't even think about that one. It'll be much easier to grind down a piece than it would be to enlarge its inner diameter...

c00nhunterjoe · May 14, 2015, 08:57:04 PM

I ground mine down as well, just dont remember the thickness i used. It was trial and error based on what i got my hands on 1st, and how i liked the steering effort.

ws23rt · May 14, 2015, 09:42:58 PM

I'm glad to see this topic back again. I intended to do this awhile back to the Saginaw pump in my C500 but didn't get around to it.

The FSM calls the Saginaw pump the ".94 pump". My 69 Coronet has a "1.06 pump" (which is the one with the round neck). The flow control valve in the 1.06 pump looks similar to the one in the .94 pump.

Has anyone done this fix on the 1.06 pump?

I'm up to trying this fix on my 1.06 pump and will get back with what I find.

myk · May 15, 2015, 01:46:55 AM

I forgot there were two pump styles. How do I identify them again? Is the 'mod the same for both?

ws23rt · May 15, 2015, 02:20:13 AM

Quote from: myk on May 15, 2015, 01:46:55 AM
I forgot there were two pump styles. How do I identify them again? Is the 'mod the same for both?

The FSM calls the pump with the round neck the 1.06 pump. (I forgot the manufacture name). The Saginaw pump is the one in the article of topic and the FSM calls it the .94 pump.

As far as the mod. being the same for both? That is the question I asked in my post. I am about to attempt a change to mine to see if the fix works for it as well.

c00nhunterjoe · May 15, 2015, 11:15:52 AM

I think the round neck is the trw pump.

myk · May 15, 2015, 12:34:06 PM

Insert popcorn smiley here...

c00nhunterjoe · May 15, 2015, 03:06:30 PM

I MIGHT still have a trw pump. I will check in the morning.

Kern Dog · May 17, 2015, 06:36:08 PM

The stuff I read was that washers stacks of approx. .125 thick was the tipping point where the boost almost goes away. That is 1/8". I did this on a pump in a 72 Duster and it still had plenty of assist. I may have to add another thin washer and report back.

myk · May 18, 2015, 02:14:02 AM

Quote from: Kern Dog on May 17, 2015, 06:36:08 PM
The stuff I read was that washers stacks of approx. .125 thick was the tipping point where the boost almost goes away. That is 1/8". I did this on a pump in a 72 Duster and it still had plenty of assist. I may have to add another thin washer and report back.

At that point wouldn't it be easier just to take the belt off of the pump?

Back N Black · June 04, 2015, 10:59:02 AM

I did the mod last night and drove the car today, definitely better feel to the steering. I used the brass washer like toocheaptosmoke installed on his pump.

ottawamerc · June 14, 2015, 07:12:38 AM

What a great thread,, I can't wait to try this when I get home. I can't stand the "over compensated" feel of the stock steering and to think it was THIS easy, damn I love this site

Scott

ottawamerc · June 16, 2015, 06:52:10 AM

So I checked my pump last night and it doesn't seem to be like the one described here? My pressure line is on the top front of the pump, what kind is it and does this mod work for this model too?

Scott

Hard Charger · June 16, 2015, 08:22:54 AM

picture?

ottawamerc · June 17, 2015, 06:47:23 AM

Same as this one..

Scott

Pete in NH · June 18, 2015, 07:59:23 AM

Hi,

That pump is what Chrysler a Federal 1.06 pump. The pump the pressure relief vale modification used is the other style of pump Chrysler used, the Saginaw .94 pump. I don't know where the pressure relief valve is on a 1.06 pump but I don't think the modification will work as outlined.

myk · June 18, 2015, 08:39:07 AM

There has to be a way to modify that pump as well...

Back N Black · June 18, 2015, 11:44:58 AM

Quote from: ottawamerc on June 17, 2015, 06:47:23 AM
Same as this one..

Scott

For you pump the pressure relief valve is inside the pump behind the pulley, you have to remove the pulley and reservoir tank to remove the pressure relief valve.

ottawamerc · June 20, 2015, 07:44:33 AM

After a quick search I found this archived article http://www.moparts.org/Tech/Archive/steering/1.html May help some, I know it cleared up my questions for my Federal pump.

Scott

ottawamerc · July 01, 2015, 08:50:19 AM

Well I removed my pump last night to try to figure out this mod on my Federal pump. Once it was out of the car it is just as simple as the TRW pump, basically remove the 3 mount bolts and pull off the rear reservoir tank (easy) then the relief assembly can be seen in the back of the pump. It is held in with a inside spring clip, once removed it falls out and then just add shims. I used a copper banjo bolt washer from a brake caliper as it fit nicely then reassembled the pump and installed it. I tried it in the shop and there is a noticeable difference in the feel already I'm looking forward to road testing it if the rain ever stops in Eastern Ontario Hopefully before a 1/4Mi track day this Sat.

Sorry no pics as usual I never think of them while I get task in hand.

Scott

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