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So you wanna buy a Hellcat? Well you better sit down when you read this!!

Started by War wagon, March 01, 2015, 08:10:27 AM

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War wagon

March 01, 2015, 08:10:27 AM
http://blog.chryslergroupllc.com/2015/02/27/avoiding-hellcat-ordering-disappointment/

How do we as customers find out the sales figures for the dealerships? Where can we find the info of what ranking the dealerships are? How many orders does the dealer have and what status are they??
REALLY???? WTF!!
they release this statement 7 months AFTER order banks opened in Canada , why not 6 months PRIOR to the release so folks can at least attempt to do their homework.
What a crock of shite this is turning into!!
They claim they aren't ltd cars but after 6 months production they have made 121 cars for Canada and build no more than 7 per wk for this country. 7 months production left and now the rules change again so each dealer that ACCUALLY qualifies for "allotments" will only get only per month.
Thought I was buying a dodge not a Bugatti !!

Ponch ®

#2
March 01, 2015, 11:31:03 AM
Quote from: War wagon on March 01, 2015, 08:10:27 AM
http://blog.chryslergroupllc.com/2015/02/27/avoiding-hellcat-ordering-disappointment/

How do we as customers find out the sales figures for the dealerships? Where can we find the info of what ranking the dealerships are? How many orders does the dealer have and what status are they??
REALLY???? WTF!!
they release this statement 7 months AFTER order banks opened in Canada , why not 6 months PRIOR to the release so folks can at least attempt to do their homework.
What a crock of shite this is turning into!!
They claim they aren't ltd cars but after 6 months production they have made 121 cars for Canada and build no more than 7 per wk for this country. 7 months production left and now the rules change again so each dealer that ACCUALLY qualifies for "allotments" will only get only per month.
Thought I was buying a dodge not a Bugatti !!


the alloment guidelines have been public for months. Ostensibly, their aim is to prevent stealerships from jacking up the price of the car: ie. if the mark it up so much that it sits in the showroom for x amount of time, the dealer cant get more Hellcats.

I asked my local dealer (generally a good place to do business with) out of curiosity a few months ago about the hellcats - they told me that theyd taken a bunch deposits but were only getting one car at first and whoever made w the $ first would get to take it home.

so they finally got the car in. Its been sitting in the showroom for weeks w a $15K mark up. I guess the people  who put deposits down didnt want it that badly after all. If i was buying a hellcat id be going elsewhere even though ive bought 3 cars there. Odds are theyre not getting  another one any time soon.
"I spent most of my money on cars, birds, and booze. The rest I squandered." - George Best

Chrysler Performance West

myk

#3
March 01, 2015, 11:43:05 AM
Meh, rich-people problems...

GOTWING

#4
March 01, 2015, 11:49:23 AM
Another version of the same problem, My father is fed up with it. He wants a B5 blue one, he has driven and wasted hours and hours on the subject. SRT has B5 available on their website, dealers say not happening, and here he sold his 13k original mile 62 Belvedere to put towards one.

https://autos.yahoo.com/news/dodge-buyers-beware-dishonest-hellcat-dealers-203022842.html

ACUDANUT

#5
March 01, 2015, 11:49:37 AM
My question is, if there such a high demand for these cars, why doesn't Chrysler try to make some money and build more ?

Ghoste

#7
March 01, 2015, 02:59:59 PM
CAFE is the biggest reason. 

dyslexic teddybear

#8
March 01, 2015, 04:06:56 PM
My understanding CAFE has minimal affect.......the number of Hellcats is a very small part of production.

Seems to be an issue of parts availability to build them......as soon as the initial rush to be the first to have one is over, production will fill demand.....and anyone who has the means will be able to get one.

Happens every time something new is introduced.......mad rush the first year......then it gets easier to get.

Why would anyone expect any difference? :scratchchin:

b5blue

#9
March 01, 2015, 04:41:01 PM
  This happens anytime a limited production car comes to market. Both dealers and flippers see a window for feeding their greed. Back in 1977 with the reissue of Z/28 I saw the same thing. It's happened again and again across the board with all makes and models when introduced. Next will be skyrocketing insurance cost as the car is profiled high risk prone. 
  I found my Z/28  back in 77 and got 1,500.00 off the sticker price at a dealer in farm country who just sold trucks. Check dealers out in the sticks?  :shruggy:

Ponch ®

#10
March 01, 2015, 05:02:02 PM
Quote from: b5blue on March 01, 2015, 04:41:01 PM
  This happens anytime a limited production car comes to market. Both dealers and flippers see a window for feeding their greed. Back in 1977 with the reissue of Z/28 I saw the same thing. It's happened again and again across the board with all makes and models when introduced. Next will be skyrocketing insurance cost as the car is profiled high risk prone. 
  I found my Z/28  back in 77 and got 1,500.00 off the sticker price at a dealer in farm country who just sold trucks. Check dealers out in the sticks?  :shruggy:

its an entirely different beast now that even the most remote dealer can go on jalopnik.com and know how much hype there is around the car and how much other dealerships are selling it for.
"I spent most of my money on cars, birds, and booze. The rest I squandered." - George Best

Chrysler Performance West

ws23rt

#11
March 01, 2015, 05:31:30 PM
I agree that this is a bit different beast than we saw when the first challenger came out in for 08.

The difference is that dodge/fiat made something that pushes into the performance territory of cars that cost 100k and above and priced it low enough that many more (perhaps then they expected) buyers are on board to get one.

I became interested in the 08 when it was released but with only three colors (none were for me) and auto only, I sat back and watched.

The 09 came out with the six sp man. trans and that moved me to buy but I still had to wait for a dealer that would order one for msrp.

This situation is the same as it was in 08 with the exception of a greater number of potential buyers (in my opinion due to the advertised msrp).

I like many others will not go over msrp as a matter of principal if nothing else.

If this car came out at 90k msrp (for example) I would be out as would many others and all this exasperation we see would not be such a big topic.

ws23rt

#12
March 01, 2015, 05:58:55 PM
I've been in touch with the dealer that sold me my 09 SRT and he offered me a real good deal on a 015 SRT.  I told him that the difference between that and what I already have is not enough for me to pay another twenty grand.

This got me thinking about what I would get for another thirty grand?  There is the cool factor :shruggy: that is worth something.  I am one of those that like the extra potential but most likely would never come close to using all of it.

I wonder about the next step up with power and tec. ----1100hp?---would that be something that would sell to the masses just because of the hp number???----I suspect an 1100hp car for 50k would attract many :slap:

Lord Warlock

#13
March 01, 2015, 06:54:20 PM
We challenger owners were predicting that dodge would offer the hellcat at 70k+, and for a brief moment in time we were ecstatic when dodge announced MSRP at 59.9k for the hellcat.   At 59k I was pretty much out of luck, the only way I could afford one would be to sell my charger, and no matter how fast the hellcat is, it wouldn't match my memories of a kid with a charger in high school and how I've sacrificed to keep it garaged ever since and its lasted me 40 years now.  I was actually considering selling off all my other cars as well as my 2010 RT-C to get payments down in a range I could stomach for the Hellcat, but after seeing what the dealers have been doing price wise, its a no-go for me now and for some time in the future.  A local dealer has been advertising one on craigslist for 80k.  dreamers.  Can't really say I'm surprised though, Ford did the same with the Shelby mustang for the first 3 years it came out you couldn't find one at msrp.  I was ready to trade my svt in for one except wouldn't pay over sticker for one. 

After the letdown, I went and had my long overdue dental work done and ended up spending over 40k just on new teeth...so much for car toys for a while.  Had planned ahead for this and put aside what I thought it would cost....lol missed it by 30k, but eating real food everyday made more sense to me than being able to go really really fast for a few minutes every now and then.

It doesn't rule out a hellcat from the used car market though, if a viper can depreciate down to 25k and still not have too many miles on it, the hellcat will also, and I may be able to afford one someday.  
69 RT/SE Y3 cream yellow w/tan vinyl top and black r/t stripe. non matching 440/375, 3:23, Column shift auto w/buddy seat, tan interior, am/fm w/fr to back fade, Now wears 17" magnum 500 rims and Nitto tires. Fresh repaint, new interior, new wheels and tires.

ws23rt

#14
March 01, 2015, 07:20:05 PM
^^^ :2thumbs:
Something like the hellcat can be a lot of fun but at what price for that small part of out lives?

Our health and comfort is what we have from waking till sleeping and is what makes our lives and moods as they are.

I'm going through questions and answers about the usual aging issues.---back pain---hearing loss---general weakness--  If those things can be fixed or improved that is a much better investment for good life than a hellcat.

I've had fun hot cars all my life and there is no stopping new ones from raising my interest.  If I was in a wheelchair or was blind I would still follow the latest new stuff but at some point we must let it go.

   BTW   "youth IS wasted on the young" ;)

Paul G

#15
March 01, 2015, 08:02:32 PM
I am going to wait and see what happens in the next few years. I would love to own a Hellcat Charger. If in a few years the hype dies down, and prices do too, I will look for one a couple of years old. Either some dude who had to be the first to have one, and the fun is over for him, or some dude who scared the shiat out of himself and is ready to let it go.
1972 Charger Topper Special, 360ci, 46RH OD trans, 8 3/4 sure grip with 3.91 gear, 14.93@92 mph.
1973 Charger Rallye, 4 speed, muscle rat. Whatever engine right now?

Mopars Unlimited of Arizona

http://www.moparsaz.com/#

b5blue

#16
March 01, 2015, 08:33:44 PM
Quote from: Ponch ® on March 01, 2015, 05:02:02 PM
Quote from: b5blue on March 01, 2015, 04:41:01 PM
  This happens anytime a limited production car comes to market. Both dealers and flippers see a window for feeding their greed. Back in 1977 with the reissue of Z/28 I saw the same thing. It's happened again and again across the board with all makes and models when introduced. Next will be skyrocketing insurance cost as the car is profiled high risk prone. 
  I found my Z/28  back in 77 and got 1,500.00 off the sticker price at a dealer in farm country who just sold trucks. Check dealers out in the sticks?  :shruggy:

its an entirely different beast now that even the most remote dealer can go on jalopnik.com and know how much hype there is around the car and how much other dealerships are selling it for.
Very true... :scratchchin: In the end it won't matter for me. I'm sticking with my 70 Charger anyway.  :2thumbs:

Cooter

#17
March 02, 2015, 03:19:46 AM
Quote from: myk on March 01, 2015, 11:43:05 AM
Meh, rich-people problems...

Exactly....WTF should I care if dealers are screwing the ones bending over and greasing up in front of them just to be the first on their block with the latest toy?
" I have spent thousands of dollars and countless hours researching what works and what doesn't and I'm willing to share"

1974dodgecharger

#18
March 02, 2015, 06:09:55 AM
Quote from: Paul G on March 01, 2015, 08:02:32 PM
I am going to wait and see what happens in the next few years. I would love to own a Hellcat Charger. If in a few years the hype dies down, and prices do too, I will look for one a couple of years old. Either some dude who had to be the first to have one, and the fun is over for him, or some dude who scared the shiat out of himself and is ready to let it go.

Same here Paul, but Ill get a challenger.  :icon_smile_big:

wingcar

#19
March 02, 2015, 03:40:02 PM
Here are guidelines for dealers to receive a Hellcat:
1970 Daytona Charger SE "clone" (440/Auto)
1967 Charger (360,6-pak/Auto)
2008 Challenger SRT8 BLK (6.1/Auto) 6050 of 6400

Ponch ®

#21
March 02, 2015, 05:04:41 PM
"I spent most of my money on cars, birds, and booze. The rest I squandered." - George Best

Chrysler Performance West

War wagon

#22
March 02, 2015, 08:26:47 PM
It's not about being the first to own one for me, it's about accually being given a chance too buy one!

I posted the below comments on the FCA press release in the comments section. My CANADIAN friends on here might have a bit more understanding of where I'm coming from.
Customers deserve better no matter what dam country we live in.

i would like to ad my comments ,concerns and feelings to this discussion from a CANADIANS perspective.
As you know order banks opened JULY 23 2014 in Canada. Being a lifetime customer and a huge promoter of the brand to friends and family , I knew all about this car and it's launch date here in Canada.
So I started making enquiries about the car to various dealers in southern Ontario. Every dealer I spoke with said they could order a car with a minimum of 5k down to show FCA you are a serious buyer and secure a spot in line. EVERY DEALER !!!!
So I had too choose a dealer and place my deposit.
This was 8 months ago and you release rules for dealer allocation now?
Even if these allocation system was in place at the time I ordered it was not public information. Why wouldn't you release you're allocation rules 6 month PRIOR to the launch of the car as opposed to coming out with it when folks are many many months into the order process?!? Give them a chance to do some research on the dealers???

So I realized this car was special from the beginning and I would probably have the most luck with a well established dealer who had already proven themselves with high volume viper and SRT sales.

I placed my order with a Large deposit on July 24 2014 from such a dealer that has been selling the brand for 75 of its 100yr history and has a stellar reputation in the local MOPAR world.
My experience with them in the past 8 months has been fantastic and they have been as honest and forthright as one could expect.

Which gets me to some points I would like to address regarding the above press release.... This is NOT a dealer issue. All FCA has to do is close the order system. The dealers aren't the ones issuing these Von's FCA is!!

You have stated over and over that this car is not LTD production but it most certainly is ltd AVALIABLITY here in Canada. 8 months after placing my order your have "alloted" 148 cars to the entire country so far..... I'm sure you have triple that many orders in ontario alone!!
My dealer has been "alloted" 1 car out of those 148 in the country. Production figure from alpar.
Now you release this allocation press release and I have to sit here with doubts of seeing a car in 2015 or ever based on these guidelines??!! I'm 8 months into my order and was expecting spring delivery when I ordered.
It's my understanding that production has been extended for the model year but under the current guidelines any dealer can expect a maximum of 7 more cars this year? Assuming the planets align and they meet your criteria to be worthy of ordering?? And each car isn't delayed at all anywhere along the line during the process!?
How does a customer find out the dealers prior 90 days sales?? How does the customer find out where FCA ranks each dealer based on those sales?? How does a customer know how many previous hellcat orders have been allocated? Pending orders??What status?? Etc etc etc...

It's not april first right??

Please for the love of the brand, CLOSE THE ORDER BANKS!
Contact ALL VON Orders currently in the system and weed out the duplicates and Ghoste orders.
Build all confirmed sold orders and don't re open banks until backlog has been delivered.

As a CANADIAN it's becoming increasingly difficult to support the brand who is completely ignoring my business. I know we are a small insignificant part of this but our business should be valued as well.
Canada 148 cars built so far, 7 cars built per wk, 7 months left of production..... It doesn't take a rocket scientist too see many orders will go unfiled!

I placed my order sight unseen, CANADIANS where not treated to event after event showcasing the car and most hadn't seen one in person until the recent auto show.

The worst part from my perspective is the lack of info from FCA. I EXPECTED a phone call or email at very least to congratulate me on my purchase and taking a spot in line. Instead I get too read all the rumours and miss information AVALIABLE these days and have too worry wether or not I even have a valid order somewhere in the system??

I understand parts shortages etc but watching hundreds of cars for sale daily at huge market ups while confirmed sold orders go unbuilt and unverified.
This experience has been very disheartening and it has nothing to do with my dealer. They don't control how many of these cars you sell here, they don't control anything and are simply YOURE representative.

Imagine if you had Americans waiting since July for answers

Thank you for the opportunity to voice my opinions and concerns, hope this doesn't fall of deaf ears.

1974dodgecharger

#23
March 02, 2015, 10:17:58 PM
imagine if everyone in the world had a HELLCAT, would you still want it?  :icon_smile_big: :popcrn:

Lord Warlock

#25
March 02, 2015, 11:15:22 PM
someone has to be first to order one.  I don't mind if a long line forms, but dodge should sell as many as they get actual orders for, and not deliver another one till the existing one at a dealer is sold and delivered. That is part of the problem with buying a first year production vehicle, especially one with as many press releases as the hellcats have gotten.  If you have the money to spend on one, I see nothing wrong with those people getting something they love and hopefully would hang on to for a while.  I know if I got one, I'd keep it a long time, I've already kept my RT Classic as long as most people keep a new car, I'd keep a hellcat a bit longer I imagine.  Kept my 90s car for 20 years, and my 69 car for 40.

I doubt many hellcat owners actually notice a fuel leak, they just assume the engine eats the fuel a little faster than they thought otherwise.  I wouldn't be having a recall done this soon after getting the car anyway unless it was leaking a lot of fuel.  I still haven't had the recall done on my stealth...the recall is good no matter how old the car is, can get my awd transfer case redone if I need to, hasn't needed one yet.
69 RT/SE Y3 cream yellow w/tan vinyl top and black r/t stripe. non matching 440/375, 3:23, Column shift auto w/buddy seat, tan interior, am/fm w/fr to back fade, Now wears 17" magnum 500 rims and Nitto tires. Fresh repaint, new interior, new wheels and tires.

RIDELIKEHELL

#26
March 03, 2015, 07:41:22 AM
Sorry to hear this! I'd be pissed! Bayview Chrysler in Sarnia Ontario has one the got for a collector  :shruggy: It's in there showroom till the roads are good..Jazz Blue  :eek2:
AMD POSTER BOY

1968 CHARGER R/T  http://www.youtube.com/user/ridelikehell73

Paul G

#27
March 03, 2015, 07:56:41 AM
My local dealer had a couple go through the dealership already. I missed both of them. Gone before I could get there. He is not charging a premium on Hellcat's. The last one was ordered by a guy in Cali who flew in and drove it home. They have more coming in yet this year. Go figure? 
1972 Charger Topper Special, 360ci, 46RH OD trans, 8 3/4 sure grip with 3.91 gear, 14.93@92 mph.
1973 Charger Rallye, 4 speed, muscle rat. Whatever engine right now?

Mopars Unlimited of Arizona

http://www.moparsaz.com/#

War wagon

#28
March 03, 2015, 08:02:33 AM
Thanks for the support ride like hell  :cheers:
Wellington where I've ordered has a Sublime green one in the showroom atm as well. Bought and paid for waiting for clear roads to be picked up.
3 cars have to be built and deliverd then mine......
They can't tell me if I'm getting a 2015 or a 2016 8 months into my order...
The situation is really sad ,3 cars ahead of me at one of the most reputable dealers in my province and I have doubts I'll see a car this year after already waiting 8 months.
Love to register it for Moparfest :( but that isn't happening cause I doubt it will be built by then.
Canada must be close to selling out ALL 3yrs production by now considering we are only getting approx 300 cars this year.
But how would we know cause NOTHING is made public.

Beep Beep Dave

#30
March 03, 2015, 09:16:39 AM
Man I feel for you. I know I would be very frustrated too. At some point they should be thanking you for your business and letting you know if you are getting a car. I don't see this being a dealer problem as much as I see it being Dodge problem. If you get a 2016 instead are they going to honour this price? With the way our dollar took a dip in would think there will be a price increase.

Last year Chrysler was Number 1 in Canada in terms of sales. You think you'd get treated a bit better.

Dave
'69-1/2 SIXPACK/SIXBBL REGISTRY On-Line Registry for the Lift Off Hood cars!!!
Maple Leaf Mopars your Canadian Mopar site.

1970 Charger R/T

War wagon

#32
March 04, 2015, 10:01:44 AM
Quote from: Beep Beep Dave on March 03, 2015, 09:16:39 AM
Man I feel for you. I know I would be very frustrated too. At some point they should be thanking you for your business and letting you know if you are getting a car. I don't see this being a dealer problem as much as I see it being Dodge problem. If you get a 2016 instead are they going to honour this price? With the way our dollar took a dip in would think there will be a price increase.

Last year Chrysler was Number 1 in Canada in terms of sales. You think you'd get treated a bit better.

Dave

Thanks Dave, the sad part is I have so many questions and cannot seem to find answers. If my order ISNT built will it automatically become a 2016 or do I have to re order? Will the colour I picked still be AVALIABLE? Will the price be locked in or will I be paying the rumoured 15k MSRP is going up??  If they are only giving Canada 300 or so cars for the year and have I'm guessing well over a thousand orders, how many years production is already sold out in Canada and how long is the waiting list?
Contact FCA canada or SRT Canada and they say speak to your dealer? Really?? Wtf the dealer is FCA representatives and only know what they are told, CANADIAN dealers aren't told squat.
Very disappointing experience
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