1990 skyline vs 1969 Dodge Charger 440

[mopar0166]

so my buddy just imported a skyline. and well one thing led to another, and now of course we are gonna race at the end of summer.

Im seeing a twin turbo car that will run 12s in the quarter, im pretty sure that if I tightened things up etc that ill have a good chance at beating him.   

nether of us have raced in years so im sure we are both rusty

Your Thoughts /  Suggestions 

[myk]

What are your car's specs?  Is this a drag race?  Road race?  Drift competition?  Bullrun stunt?  We need more information...

[el dub]

nether of us have raced in years so im sure we are both rusty


hope its not a street race.

[bristol]

so my buddy just imported a skyline. and well one thing led to another, and now of course we are gonna race at the end of summer.

I'm seeing a twin turbo car that will run 12s in the quarter, I'm pretty sure that if I tightened things up etc that ill have a good chance at beating him.   

nether of us have raced in years so I'm sure we are both rusty

Your Thoughts /  Suggestions 

I bet that wasn't too easy. I have always read nightmare stories of federal agents showing up to confiscate someones skyline. Doesn't make sense for a skyline to meet safety standards standards, when if i imported a mini it sure wouldn't meet safety standards.

[polywideblock]

is the skyline anything special  eg 4wd or 4ws , a gt or gtr  ?   

[Ghoste]

Without knowing more about both cars its a little hard to predict.

[myk]

Without knowing more about both cars its a little hard to predict.

Here's how it's done:

So a buddy of mine just brought home a 2015 Challenger SXT "Plus" (whatever the freak that means) and suddenly he's Mr. Vanishing Point/Bullitt/Le Mans all rolled into one-a real hot shot.  It's a beautiful looking car, but I gave him s**t for spending $43K on a fat car that doesn't even have the V8!  Who spends $43K on a Challenger without the goddamn V8?!  After a little heated back and forth we decided to race to shut the other person up; of course, being the cowardly V6 owner that he is, he challenged me to a race against my '98 Mustang GT, the WEAKEST car in my stable.  Heaven forbid he go up against my Camaro Z28 or Ram-Air Firebird that would drag his "Plus" up and down the freeway and turn him into a big MINUS.

Here are the cars:

2015 Challenger SXT "Plus"
-all stock
-3.6L V6 DOHC
-8 spd A0D
-3.07 axle ratio
-vehicle weight: 4950 lbs/5150 lbs with driver (approximate)

(Google Photo, but identical car)

VS

1998 Mustang GT
-all stock
-4.6L V8 SOHC
-4 spd AOD
-3.08 axle ratio
-vehicle weight: 3,227 lbs/3,400 lbs with driver (approximate)



My cylinder-deficient friend seems to think that his beloved brochure with the advertised 305 hp will "destroy" the Mustang's 225 hp, but I reminded him that horsepower numbers sell cars, torque numbers win races: the Mustang's peak torque of 290 ft/lbs comes in @ 3500 rpm, the Challenger's 268 ft/lbs not until 4600 rpm.  Also, his land yacht of a car is HEAVY, so I've got the weight advantage as well by about 700/800 pounds.  We'll end up running the next time we meet up.  We'll do some roll races on the freeway, probably from 30 or 40, and if he brings his balls I'll get him to do a few runs from a dig as well.  I'll let you guys know what happens...

[mopar0166]

ok mine is a 69 charger, 440 ,bored .30 , comp 10:1  edelbrock power package, 850 double pumper, msd ign, electronic fuel supply. super street fighter 727 auto, 3.55 sure grip rear

the skyline is stock but he is going to take the ceramic turbos off and but aluminum ones one, other then that itl'll be stock


It is a 1/4 mile drag race, I don't really have the time to upgrade it for road racing.   

[mopar0166]

skyline is legal after 25 years, that's why itll take so long to race  cuase it wont be 25 till june

[Mike DC]

vehicle weight: 4950 lbs/5150 lbs with driver (approximate)

A 5000-lb Challenger?  With a V6?  That doesn't smell right. 

Hellcats get crap for being in the low-4000's.  And they have hundreds of pounds more motor - the blower setup adds weight in addition to the V8. 

[charger_fan_4ever]

Whoever has a full slick will win. Unless we are talking mega HP whoever wins 60 foot and leads by 1/8th mile wins.

[6spd68]

skyline is legal after 25 years

[polywideblock]

why I was asking is the  R32  gtr changed racing for ever over here  was dominated by cosworth sierras  before this  

from about 4: 00 on this clip shows how these things  go             https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yive7MqPdY8

   if its one of these( Godzilla ) it will eat a "stock"  car for breakfast  , not what you want to hear but having seen these things race    

           


R32

Nissan Skyline R32 GT-R 001.jpg

Overview


Also called
SKYLINE, BNR32 (1989–1991)

Production
1988–1994
296,087 units sold
GT-R's
Standard-40390
Nismo-560
V-Spec-1453
V-SpecII-1303
N1-228

Assembly
Musashimurayama, Japan

Designer
Naganori Ito (1987)

Body and chassis


Body style
4-door sedan
2-door coupe

Layout
Front engine, rear-wheel drive / four-wheel drive

Related
Nissan Laurel
Nissan Cefiro
Nissan Leopard (coupe)
Infiniti M30

Powertrain


Engine
1.8 L CA18i I4 (GXi)
2.0 L RB20E I6 (GTE)
2.0 L RB20DE I6 (GTS)
2.5 L RB25DE I6 (GTS-25)
2.6 L RB26DE I6 (Autech GTS-4)
2.0 L RB20DET I6 (GTS-t, Type M, GTS-4)
2.6 L RB26DETT I6 (GT-R)

Transmission
4-speed automatic
5-speed automatic
5-speed manual

Dimensions


Wheelbase
2,615 mm (103.0 in)

Length
4,580 mm (180.3 in) (sedan)

Width
1,695 mm (66.7 in)

Height
1,340 mm (52.8 in) (sedan)

Curb weight
1,280 kg (2,821.9 lb) (Type-M) 1,430 kg (3,152.6 lb) (GT-R)

The R32 Skyline debuted in May 1989. It was available as either a 2-door coupe or 4-door hardtop sedan, all other bodystyles were dropped. The R32 featured several versions of the RB-series straight-6 engines, which had improved heads (the twelve port inlet was gone) and used the ECCS (Electronically Concentrated Control System) injection system. Also available was an 1,800 cc 4-cylinder GXi model. Most models had HICAS four-wheel steering, with the rear wheels being hydraulically linked to the front steering. The 2.5-litre GTS-25 became one of the first Japanese production cars to feature a 5-speed automatic transmission. The GTS-t came in standard and Type M configurations, with the Type M having larger five-stud 16-inch wheels, four piston front callipers and twin piston rears plus other minor differences. ABS was optional (except for the GT-R and GTS-4), mechanical LSD was standard on the GTR and viscous LSD was standard on all turbo models and optional on all but the GXi. Nissan also produced 100 Australian models of the R32. In addition, there was a 4WD version of the GTS-t Type M, called the GTS-4.

The station wagon bodystyle was discontinued, and replaced by the smaller, front-wheel drive Nissan Avenir (Primera).

Models:
GXi Type-X – 1.8 L CA18i I4, 91 PS (67 kW; 90 hp)
GTE Type-X – 2.0 L RB20E I6, 125 PS (92 kW; 123 hp), 152 N m
GTS Type-X, S, J – 2.0 L RB20DE I6 155 PS (114 kW; 153 hp), 154 N m
GTS-25 Type-X, S, XG – 2.5 L RB25DE I6, 180 PS (132 kW; 178 hp), 231 N m
GTS-t, Type-M – 2.0 L RB20DET turbo I6, 215 PS (158 kW; 212 hp), 265 N m
GTS-4 – 2.0 L RB20DET turbo I6, 215 PS (158 kW; 212 hp), 265 N m 4WD
Autech GTS-4 – 2.6 L RB26DE I6, 220 PS (162 kW; 217 hp), Autech Version (auto only) 4WD - only 188 made[26]
GT-R – 2.6 L RB26DETT twin-turbo I6, 280 PS (206 kW; 276 hp), 368 N m 4WD; also NISMO, N1, V-Spec, and V-Spec II variants.
NISMO S-Tune





Nissan Skyline GTS-t four-door sedan
GT-R[edit]





R32 Nissan Skyline GT-R




The CALSONIC R32 GT-R from the Group A series
The R32 GT-R was first produced in 1988 including prototype cars. The first six Nismo's were built in 1989. The RB26DETT engine actually produced ~320 PS,[citation needed] but it was unstated due to the Japanese car makers' "gentlemen's agreement" not to exceed 280 PS (276 hp). The engine was designed for ~500 hp in racing trim,[27] and then muzzled by the exhaust, boost restriction, and ECU. The electronic boost control had a small physical restriction in the control lines. It was marked in yellow so the new owner could remove it and enjoy a safe factory boost increase.[28] After this increase the car would put out ~310 hp (~230 kW) and could do 0–100 km/h in 4.7seconds and quarter mile in 12.8 seconds.[citation needed]

The GT-R had a significantly larger intercooler, larger brakes, and aluminium front guards and bonnet. Other distinguishing features include flared front and rear wheel arches. More supportive seats were fitted, and the turbo boost gauge and digital clock were removed from inside the instrument cluster. The clock was replaced with a torque meter that indicated how much torque was being delivered to the front wheels (0%–50%). Oil temp, voltage, and turbo boost gauges were fitted just above the climate control.

The Porsche 959 was Nissan's target when designing the GT-R. The chief engineer, Naganori Ito, intended to use the car for Group A racing, so the design specification was drawn up in conjunction with a copy of the Group A rules. The Nordschleife production car record at the time of development was 8'45" – set by a Porsche 944. Nissan test driver Hiroyoshi Katoh reset the record with a time of 8'20".[29] Best Motoring managed 8'22"38.[30]

The R32 GT-R dominated Japanese Touring Car Championship (JTCC), winning 29 races from 29 starts, taking the series title every year from 1989 to 1993.[31] It took 50 races from 50 starts from 1991 to 1997 (latterly R33) in the N1 Super Taikyu.

The R32 GT-R was introduced into the Australian Touring Car Championship in 1990 and promptly ended the reign of the previously all-conquering Ford Sierra Cosworth, winning Bathurst 1000 classic in 1991 and 1992. This success led to the Australian motoring press nicknaming the car Godzilla due to it being a "monster from Japan". As Australia was the first export market for the car the name quickly spread. Such was GT-R's dominance that it was a significant factor in the demise of Group A Touring Car racing, the formula being scrapped soon after. JTCC was similarly blighted by the R32 GT-R, and splintered soon after, leading to the switch to the Supertouring category and also indirectly to the GT500 category of today.

When originally designed, the homologation rulebook mandated 16-inch wheels, so that's what the GT-R got. This limited the size of the brakes, and the Nissan four pots weren't really up to competition use. A later change in rules allowed 17-inch wheels, so in February 1993 the GT-R V-spec (for Victory) emerged wearing 17" BBS mesh wheels(225/50/17) covering larger Brembo brakes. The clutch actuation changed from a push to a pull system, the car had the standard rear differential, the electronic rear differential did not show up until the R33 Vspec. A year later the V-Spec II appeared with a new sticker and wider tires (245/45 17).[32]

The Nismo Skyline GT-R is a limited (500 street, 60 racing) version of Nissan Skyline with Nissan RB engine with twin ceramic turbochargers rated 280 PS (206 kW; 276 hp) at 6,800 rpm and 353 N·m (260 lb·ft) at 4,400 rpm, all-wheel steering, electronically controlled four-wheel drive.[33]

The Skyline GT-R is eligible for US import under the NHTSA 'Show or Display' rule, that allows vehicles with historical or technological significance to be imported even though they do not comply with Federal motor vehicle safety standards.[34][35]

[Cooter]

He'll still have butthurt after you possibly lose due to the sheer coolness of that 50 y/o Charger over that jap crap.

[HPP]

skyline is legal after 25 years

x2.  Trailer it to the track, unload, race. Question answered. But I' think you'll loose this one on the top end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Tjx4pra7MY

[Ponch ®]

vehicle weight: 4950 lbs/5150 lbs with driver (approximate)

A 5000-lb Challenger?  With a V6?  That doesn't smell right.  

Hellcats get crap for being in the low-4000's.  And they have hundreds of pounds more motor - the blower setup adds weight in addition to the V8.  

He paid $43K for it. Its probably all the options that are weighing it down.  

[6spd68]

The Skyline GT-R is eligible for US import under the NHTSA 'Show or Display' rule, that allows vehicles with historical or technological significance to be imported even though they do not comply with Federal motor vehicle safety standards.[34][35]

They've been legal to own and import into Canada pretty much forever...  Which is odd seeing as American laws are usually looser...

[Ghoste]

I think they may be tighter on emission stuff.

[Patronus]

Its all the start, snap him and put the pedal down! 

[myk]

vehicle weight: 4950 lbs/5150 lbs with driver (approximate)

A 5000-lb Challenger?  With a V6?  That doesn't smell right. 

Hellcats get crap for being in the low-4000's.  And they have hundreds of pounds more motor - the blower setup adds weight in addition to the V8. 

I got the weight off of Edmunds.com.  I really think it is all of the tacked on garbage that's pigging out his car. Does the Hellcat have weight reduction from the factory?

[six-tee-nine]

Its all the start, snap him and put the pedal down! 

If the skyline is a GT-R with 4 wheel drive you might gonna have problem right there. By the time you finally have traction he'll probably be a car length ahead. Unless you have way more engine power you might catch up but when the cars are kinda the same power wise you might end up looking at his tail all the way.

Doesnt matter wether you win or loose, you are definatly going down the track in much more style than he is and 99.99% of the crowd will be on your side....

[Nwcharger]

The Skyline GT-R is eligible for US import under the NHTSA 'Show or Display' rule, that allows vehicles with historical or technological significance to be imported even though they do not comply with Federal motor vehicle safety standards.[34][35]

They've been legal to own and import into Canada pretty much forever...  Which is odd seeing as American laws are usually looser...

in the U.S. in order to import a vehicle to drive on the street it needs to comply with epa and dot safety standards and have a label on the car stating it complys. Cars 25 years old are exempt from this issue and can be imported for the street with no issues. Canada has a 15 year rule so they get to import them 10 years before we can. There are some cars that are newer than 25 years that can either be imported with no hassle or modified to comply with epa/dot but it gets complicated. I found all this out almost 10 years ago trying to import a jdm Honda from Canada.

[polywideblock]

we have the same 25  year limit over here , anything before 1989  can be imported and rego'd left drive no prob's       

  only another 5 years before I can get that ram I've always wanted 

[mopar0166]

skyline is legal after 25 years

its considered an importable classic car , I dunno the specifics but its something like that

[mopar0166]

I love all the opinions, 

what suggestions do y'all for grasping an edge , better gears better tires, etc 

or maybe 25 k for a blown hemi  haha  j/k 


I think where I get a little edge is that he hasn't dragged anything longer then me and hopefully will have a better reaction time then him as well.

[Patronus]

Ok....
Put some 4:11 gears in it...
Then get some drag radials on a couple Bassetts...
...some quick frame connectors..
and sneaky pete the hell out of it!
Hows your brakes? You running discs??
You gotta get that power hooked and down.
yeah-yeah

[mopar0166]

well I was planning on using slicks, putting in better gears for the race(normally run 3.55's), I do already have frame connectors

[6spd68]

Record it regardless, then post it here! 

[mopar0166]

im going to and we will have pics,

videos if im successful   

[Sabre]

Without knowing more about both cars its a little hard to predict.

Here's how it's done:

So a buddy of mine just brought home a 2015 Challenger SXT "Plus" (whatever the freak that means) and suddenly he's Mr. Vanishing Point/Bullitt/Le Mans all rolled into one-a real hot shot.  It's a beautiful looking car, but I gave him s**t for spending $43K on a fat car that doesn't even have the V8!  Who spends $43K on a Challenger without the goddamn V8?!  After a little heated back and forth we decided to race to shut the other person up; of course, being the cowardly V6 owner that he is, he challenged me to a race against my '98 Mustang GT, the WEAKEST car in my stable.  Heaven forbid he go up against my Camaro Z28 or Ram-Air Firebird that would drag his "Plus" up and down the freeway and turn him into a big MINUS.

Here are the cars:

2015 Challenger SXT "Plus"
-all stock
-3.6L V6 DOHC
-8 spd A0D
-3.07 axle ratio
-vehicle weight: 4950 lbs/5150 lbs with driver (approximate)

(Google Photo, but identical car)

VS

1998 Mustang GT
-all stock
-4.6L V8 SOHC
-4 spd AOD
-3.08 axle ratio
-vehicle weight: 3,227 lbs/3,400 lbs with driver (approximate)



My cylinder-deficient friend seems to think that his beloved brochure with the advertised 305 hp will "destroy" the Mustang's 225 hp, but I reminded him that horsepower numbers sell cars, torque numbers win races: the Mustang's peak torque of 290 ft/lbs comes in @ 3500 rpm, the Challenger's 268 ft/lbs not until 4600 rpm.  Also, his land yacht of a car is HEAVY, so I've got the weight advantage as well by about 700/800 pounds.  We'll end up running the next time we meet up.  We'll do some roll races on the freeway, probably from 30 or 40, and if he brings his balls I'll get him to do a few runs from a dig as well.  I'll let you guys know what happens...

Your buddy got jipped if he paid $43,000 for an SXT Plus 2015 Challenger. They start at $26,000 and a heavily optioned car hits $33,000 on the "build it now" feature on Dodges website.  The Scat Pack R/T's START at $38,000 and they have the 6.4 392 cubic inch Hemi.  They put out 485 hp and 475 lb ft tq.

Anyways, the Challenger Hellcat is the heaviest of the Challengers at 4,400 lbs.  The others are 4,100 lbs give or take.

[Lord Warlock]

Really think you are gonna get burned by a skyline.  The difference in technology is worlds apart.  I have fond memories of driving my charger in a harsh manner when young and the charger wasn't quite old yet, and then in the 90s bought a twin turbo stealth, which is basically a jap 6 cyl with twin mini turbos in it (9b's stock, 13G's stock in Europe) Totally stock with the tiny turbos, the stealth ran mid 13 sec quarters.  With an exhaust, intake and larger 13G turbos, it runs mid 12s, and is hands down the fastest street car I've driven between 80 and 130.  The risk the jap car has is twisting the half shafts off launching hard with AWD.

Anyways, the stealth is faster than my more or less stock 440 auto 69 charger.  Although today it may be a different story with a set of Nitto 315 17's Drag radials on the back.  The charger still holds sway over me overall, but there is a reason why I kept both the charger and the stealth for the last 20 years (charger 40 stealth 21)

The stealth was only rated at 300 hp back in 91 when mine was built. And it weighs more than the charger does.  But it grips hard with all 4 wheels, and 2nd gear is its playground, from 45 to 90mph in 2nd  gear, never had anything hang with me in 2nd, they'd catch me in 3rd if they caught me at all.  I had a fun time driving that car for 10 years throughout the 90s. Maybe I'll get to drive it again soon.  Its next on the fix it list, stored it in the backyard with the charger 10 years ago after I put a new engine, new turbos, new exhaust, new brakes and new tires on it.  Got tired of it and was anxious to get started on the charger after waiting so long to start. 

The skyline (especially the GTR) should be faster than the stealth used to be, so I'd be expecting close to 12.5-12.9 in it. If its the GTR its down near 11.9.  Not too many old chargers actually running 11s these days, a few yes, but not many.

[Patronus]

http://www.jegs.com/i/NOS/741/05029/10002/-1

[GOTWING]

For what it's worth on the 98 Mustang GT 4.6 auto. One of my very good friends bought a blue one brand new it ran 15:60's. The 96-98 are not fast at all. I had a 99 GT 4.6 5spd. stone stock with the stock 3.27's it ran a best of 13:79......... Then after 3.73 gears and other bolt ons it went 13:11 @ 102mph on Nittos.
I can't get over the $40k plus price tag on the V6 Challenger ! our plum crazy 2010 R/T heritage Challenger with the 5.7 hemi auto was around that out the door with taxes and tags ! 

[Lord Warlock]

You mean a classic with heritage wheels? I agree, I can't believe a v6 challenger sxt even loaded comes close to 40k, my 2010 CLASSIC Detonator Yellow R/T with the 5.7 stickered at 39, 828, and I was waffling back and forth between it and a cheaper srt8 that stickered at 44k that I could have gotten for 41.  Got the classic for 35.5k out the door.

My 2000 GT mustang with 3:73 gears probably only ran a 13.5.  It was peppy but not near peppy enough, traded it for an 04 terminator which got me thru 2010 when I sold it for the challenger.

[mopar0166]

I agree with the nos cheater kit, but have also looked at the edlebrok kit as well. 

im gonna be set up  run but its not like he not running an power adders, so im looking at that .  anyone ever use one of those NOs  cheater kits