My Clutch/Transmission Problem

[Dmichels]

I have started a new thread about my ongoing problem see http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,104904.msg1417102.html#msg1417102
In a nut shell once the trans oil heats up it is very hard to get into first gear. My belief is the cold thick oil causes enough drag to keep the input shaft from turning when the clutch is disengage. I think the clutch is dragging. I pulled the trans the other day and started checking things. Keep in mind this was an automatic car. So far
The pilot hole in the crank is drilled deep enough
The pilot bearing is fine
my initial measurement shows the bell housing run out is .016 out this may be an issue.
I noticed the clutch fingers have contacted the pressure plate springs this happened when I over adjusted the clutch in an attempt to see if I was not getting enough disc free play yes I did under adjusted the clutch to see if I was the issue.
I am almost positive the linkage parts are correct.
The clutch and disc were new from Brewer's
I am going to check the run out on the clutch disc
I am going to pull down the trans.
Any other things guys I am open to any suggestions.
Thanks Dave

[John_Kunkel]

If the BH runout  is actually .016" that could be your problem but if it's .016" TIR that's only .008" runout...still not good but not so much of a problem.

[Dmichels]

John thanks for responding The .016 is total run out. This was my first reading 10 at night cold and tired I am going to check it again.

[c00nhunterjoe]

Is it all gears, or just 1st?

[Dmichels]

It will shift into all gears when cold including reverse. Once the oil thins out It can be nearly impossible to get it into first second is not any much easier. I have jammed it in , it does not grind just very hard to get in.  It will grind reverse I never tried third or forth. Now this is at a complete stop. once moving it shifts ok. If I am at a slow roll I can get it into 1st.

[c00nhunterjoe]

It will shift into all gears when cold including reverse. Once the oil thins out It can be nearly impossible to get it into first second is not any much easier. I have jammed it in , it does not grind just very hard to get in.  It will grind reverse I never tried third or forth. Now this is at a complete stop. once moving it shifts ok. If I am at a slow roll I can get it into 1st.

Hard in gear, grinds reverse, sure sounds like an engaged clutch to me.

[Dmichels]

that's what I am thinking I just need to find out WHY Not easy now that it is going to be COLD the next few days

[PlainfieldCharger]

Just want to throw this out there. What type of oil do you have in the 4 speed. It is a GL4 or GL5 product? The GL5(hypoid) gets on the syncros and will not let them engage. My trans was doing the same thing. Switched it over to this.

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/red-50304
Redline MT90

My problem is gone...

[Dmichels]

I am using GL-4
3 degrees F tonight so no garage time
Thank you to everyone's input
Dave

[Dmichels]

I just checked the run out on the bell housing again and got .010 total run out so it looks like I am in spec. I am off to check the run out on the clutch disc. While I am thinking about it. anyone ever had a bent input shaft?

[John_Kunkel]

With the dust cover removed from the BH have somebody sit in the car and fully depress the clutch pedal, then use feeler gauges to measure the clutch disc clearance, should be around .060" or more....then use a long screwdriver to see if the disc spins freely and moves freely back and forth.

[Dmichels]

Thank you John I will check that What is the next step if I do not have enough release?

[John_Kunkel]

If you don't get sufficient air gap with the pedal fully depressed it's likely adjustment or mismatched parts.

[Dmichels]

In continuing to find my issue I am checking all components of the clutch. Is there  min thickness spec on the flywheel? Other then the obvious problem of the clutch hub hitting the flywheel bolts are there any other issues with a thin flywheel?  Does this somehow throw the geometry of the linkage off? I know mine has had a good bit taken off of it. Thank you for your input
Dave

[Mick70RR]

Did you check that the clutch disc was a nice fit on the input shaft splines before you bolted up the clutch? I've known them to bind on the input shaft before and need a bit of work with a stone to clean the splines up.

[Dmichels]

Yes it is a nice fit on the splines. This problem really has me baffled. I decided to rebuild the transmission again while we have things apart. New syncros and replaced 1st and 2nd gear, because the engagement teeth were crappy. I put the input shaft between centers and it looks like it has .009 total run out. So I bought a new one of them too. So $700 later my trans will be next to new. I still have to try John Kunkel's test to measure the clutch gap when the peddle is depressed. The bell housing is .010 to .012 total run out. It is still in spec but I am still going put in the offset pins to take it down to .001 to.002 out I just want to cover all the bases before I start putting things back together. Any other Ideas???
Thanks Guys
Dave