4 hole carb spacer

[Dino]

There's something going on with the TQ, after another rebuild it's now the driver's side venture that drips instead of the other one so this carb is coming off for a thorough overhaul.   

In the meantime I'm going to bolt on an Edelbrock 1406.  I have an Edelbrock performer intake and I have the square hole plate to mate the two but I'd like to run a 4 hole spacer instead.  I have the TQ sitting on a felt that's about 1/4" thick, maybe a bit more.  The carb height may be a little lower than the eddy but not by much.  Would I have any trouble with the throttle cable and bracket if I install a 1/2" 4 hole spacer under the eddy carb?  Would I still need the adapter plate seeing the manifold is spreadbore or will the spacer take care of that?  If the spacer is too thick are there thinner ones and would they still be effective in blocking much of the heat?

[don duick]

1/2 inch 4 hole spacer on an edelbrock performer (spreadbore) inlet works. That is what I have. I used the bakelight spacer as it helps with keeping the carb cooler. works with both holley or edelbrock carb. You will not need the adaptor plate.

[Dino]

Awesome, that's what I was hoping for.  Do I have to use an Edelbrock spacer or can it be a different brand?  I'm not sure if the holes are all the same size or not depending on the brand.

Thanks!   

[don duick]

 any brand should work, mine is an unknown brand. If the bolt holes do not line up clamp it to your carb or gasket and drill them to suit. I know there are 2 different bolt patterns for carbies as you will notice how the edelbrock carbs have 2 sets of holes.

[Dino]

Thanks Don!    

Since the primaries are smaller than the secondaries, can I get a spacer that has 4 equal holes sized like the secondaries or should there be a spacer that matches the different bore sizes?

Primaries are 1 7/16 and secondaries are 1 11/16 so does this not make it a spread bore instead of a square bore?

[don duick]

get the spacer with 4 equal size holes. I have never seen a spacer that perfectly fits the edelbrock carb. I realise the primaries are smaller, I suppose technically you might refer to this as a spreadbore but it is not, it is still referred to as being a squarebore. I tried an open spacer on mine and did not notice any difference, I saw a youtube clip where they picked up 10 hp on a small block chev using an open spacer.

[Dino]

Yeah open spacers are reommended for hp increase, but I'm after torque so the 4 hole would or should be the better choice.  I'll see what the local parts stores have, I may find a spectre spacer or something and if not I'll order one online.  For now I'm just going to use the adapter to put a scuare bore on a spreadbore intake so I can compare with the spacer later or I'll never know if it works.  My 1407 didn't have fuel boiling issues once I blocked the heat crossover so the car should run fine either way. 

I guess in order to call it a spread bore it needs a bit more than a small difference in bore sizes.  I didn't know that the secondaries were the same size as the 1407 until I compared them so I'm curious to see how it runs.   

Thanks a million for the help Don!   

[don duick]

I have a 600 edelbrock carb as a spare when my tempermental holley plays up. The edelbrock carb runs so good and very reliable wish it was a 750 but I have read the 750 version is not as good?. I bought a 750 holley HP series carb and having problems tuning it so am using the 600 eddy ay the moment. If you have the correct jets ands rods you will be very happy with it. Hope it works well for you.

[Dino]

I have a 600 edelbrock carb as a spare when my tempermental holley plays up. The edelbrock carb runs so good and very reliable wish it was a 750 but I have read the 750 version is not as good?. I bought a 750 holley HP series carb and having problems tuning it so am using the 600 eddy ay the moment. If you have the correct jets ands rods you will be very happy with it. Hope it works well for you.

Thanks!

I have the 750 version as well and I never got it to run right.   I'm sure my cam is part of the problem but others have said the same about the 750.  On a stockish engine it should be decent with the right jets though, I would think.

[kokxville]

Dino,

get a proform carb.I replaced my edelbrock for a 750 street use carb.Fixed all my problems 
You may ask Firefighter Ron here.He helped me out.

John 

[myk]

I have a 600 edelbrock carb as a spare when my tempermental holley plays up. The edelbrock carb runs so good and very reliable wish it was a 750 but I have read the 750 version is not as good?. I bought a 750 holley HP series carb and having problems tuning it so am using the 600 eddy ay the moment. If you have the correct jets ands rods you will be very happy with it. Hope it works well for you.

Thanks!

I have the 750 version as well and I never got it to run right.   I'm sure my cam is part of the problem but others have said the same about the 750.  On a stockish engine it should be decent with the right jets though, I would think.

Another disgruntled 'Eddy 750 user here...

[Dino]

Dino,

get a proform carb.I replaced my edelbrock for a 750 street use carb.Fixed all my problems 
You may ask Firefighter Ron here.He helped me out.

John 

Hey John, if ever I decide to go back to a square bore 750 that is exactly what I will get.   

[Dino]

I have the 1406 in place without a spacer for now, simply the adapter plate sandwiched between two gaskets.  It started up great but I need to turn the idle up over 1000 rpm to keep it running and then still it dies a lot, it'll die when you put it in gear as well.  Starts right back up though and has pretty good throttle response. 

First thing on the list for tomorrow is measuring fuel pressure and checking the floats.  I didn't touch them and I should have since it was shipped.  I know the floats are pretty sensitive.

Once it's setup I'll do some testing and then put a spacer on to see what, if any, difference it makes.

[don duick]

a spacer wont solve the problem you have now. Pcv valve hose hooked up? idle mixture screws set? no air leaks, spacer and gasket fully sealed? the problem you have now is unusual for a 600 eddy. the last time I had this problem I forgot to connect the hose for the pcv valve.

[Dino]

PCV hose is hooked up but it's really stiff so I'll get another.  I don't suppose I can use a piece of fuel hose to test it?  I have plenty of that laying around.  I'll check for air leaks, I covered the horn with my hand and the car choked and died so I assumed it was okay but I'll spray some carb cleaner around the base to make sure.  Idle mixture screws are currently set at 2 turns out.  The idle is so high that I can seat them both without any change, the car just keeps on running.

It's funny, although it has these issues, you can tell that the car will run smoother than before, not to mention there is no more fuel smell!

I'll open up the carb today, is there anything I need to pay special attention to besides clogged passageways?

[Dino]

I forgot to add this.  The carb came with a banjo fitting and since I didn't know if I was keeping this carb or not, I didn't buy a metal fuel line yet so I ran a rubber hose from the vapor separator to the carb.  This is merely for testing, once I decide I'm keeping the carb I'll get the proper line.  When looking straight at the passenger side of the carb, the banjo fitting points to the 8 o'clock position so down and towards the firewall.  This way the rubber hose is not laying on or near the valve cover to keep it cooler.  This may be completely unrelated to the carb's actions but could it be that the bend going onto the banjo fitting is too tight?  I can aim it down a bit to increase the angle the hose makes.

I'll start by spraying some cleaner around the base to check for leaks and then will remove the carb and open it up to clean it and check the floats.  The carb sits on an Edelbrock adapter plate #2732 with Mr. Gasket #54 on either side.  Is that alright?

[Charger-Bodie]

I forgot to add this.  The carb came with a banjo fitting and since I didn't know if I was keeping this carb or not, I didn't buy a metal fuel line yet so I ran a rubber hose from the vapor separator to the carb.  This is merely for testing, once I decide I'm keeping the carb I'll get the proper line.  When looking straight at the passenger side of the carb, the banjo fitting points to the 8 o'clock position so down and towards the firewall.  This way the rubber hose is not laying on or near the valve cover to keep it cooler.  This may be completely unrelated to the carb's actions but could it be that the bend going onto the banjo fitting is too tight?  I can aim it down a bit to increase the angle the hose makes.

I'll start by spraying some cleaner around the base to check for leaks and then will remove the carb and open it up to clean it and check the floats.  The carb sits on an Edelbrock adapter plate #2732 with Mr. Gasket #54 on either side.  Is that alright?

Can you post a pic of the adapter plate? Those things can cause a lot of trouble. As for the fuel fitting, that shouldn't hurt anything.

[Dino]

This is the one.

Edelbrock says it's the one needed to bolt a square bore carb to a spread bore intake.  I used the same plate on the 1407 and it worked fine but I only used one gasket instead of two.  I figured two would be better.

[Charger-Bodie]

That one is fine. I was thinking thick aluminum junk.

[Dino]

That one is fine. I was thinking thick aluminum junk.

Cool!  Thanks for checking.   

I decided to pull the carb first before doing anything else, just to make sure all is well with it.  When I pulled it I snapped a few pictures of the gasket.  Look at the driver's side of the gasket, it seems to have been wet towards the back and especially on the driver's side, where the '54' imprint is.  Does this look like a vacuum leak?

[Dino]

I removed the air horn and found quite a bit of dirt in the carb so I'm off to the store to get some carb cleaner!  I checked the float height which is 7/16" when inverted, per specs, but 1.5" when right side up, it should be 15/16" to 1" so I'll adjust that.  The carb itself looks great apart from the dirt so hopefully cleaning it out, resetting the floats and tightening up the carb to the manifold will do the trick.  Or should I find another type of gasket?

[firefighter3931]

This is the one.

Edelbrock says it's the one needed to bolt a square bore carb to a spread bore intake.  I used the same plate on the 1407 and it worked fine but I only used one gasket instead of two.  I figured two would be better.

Dirk, you need two gaskets....one underneath the plate and another on top of the plate between it and the carburetor. Otherwise you will have a vacuum leak. 


Ron

[Charger-Bodie]

Make sure everything is flat and true.

[Dino]

I do have two gaskets on the 1406, only had one on the 1407.  I checked the intake manifold and the ridges are clean, but I found a small amount of caked on carbon on the inside edge of the carb rail so that may have been the culprit.  it's my own fault for not cleaning the carb BEFORE I put it on.  I just need to set the floats now and it can go back on, everything is clean again.

I ran out of carb cleaner again, should have bought two cans, so what else can I use to test for vacuum leaks?  Brake cleaner alright?  It's mainly acetone just like carb cleaner but I'm sure there's some other stuff in there.

I'll keep you posted.

Thanks fellas!   

[Dino]

Update:

The adapter plate was not perfectly flat.  I placed it on my table saw and saw it had a tiny bit of a crown in the center so I took a minute hammering it flat again.  I also flipped it concave side up so to speak and tightened the carb to ensure the plate was flat.  No more vacuum leaks.   

I took the carb apart, cleaned everything up and installed new gaskets.  It wasn't too bad, all the dirt seemed to be in the float bowls.  I also reset the floats to Eddy specs.

The car fired right up and settled into the fast idle.  I tapped the gas and it dropped to 800 rpm so I let it warm up at idle.  The venturis are no longer dumping fuel at idle!  Woohoo!!

Vacuum always used to be in the low 15 range but for the life of me I can't get it there anymore, It's around 11, same as with the TQ although that too used to pull 15.  Idle mixture screws are set to 2 turns out.  It's a bit rich coming out of the tailpipes but not too bad.  I drove around with the window down and couldn't really smell anything but by that time my sweater was a bit smelly from tuning it.  It may need some more adjustments.  I didn't touch the timing, base is still at 24 with vacuum advance disconnected.  I'll hook it back up to ported and full to compare, but not until everything is set as it should.

I left the throttle cable off while adjusting things to be sure it wasn't pulling the blades open.  I put it in drive and the idle dropped a bit but it kept right on running.  So far so good!  The idle is still not super smooth, probably because of the cam, but it's the best it's been in a long time.  Definitely good enough for now.   

I hooked up the throttle cable and it seemed that everything was alright but I guess I need to figure out how to adjust the throttle cable because I only have about an inch of travel before it hits the floor.  I don't know if it's the cable or just the carb, but compared to the TQ this thing is pretty gutless.  There's no way to make the tires spin now, not even in first gear. 

However, it cruises beautifully and for now that's what I need.     This is the first time this year I could drive for 30 minutes without seeing the needle on the fuel gauge drop.   

I'm looking through the FSM to figure out how to set the throttle cable but if someone can explain it I would be very grateful.  Kickdown linkage seems to be where it is.  Under light throttle it shifts into third around 47 mph.  Is that about right?

From idle I have a bit of a bog if I punch it but it's not nearly as bad as the one my 750 had.  I have the accelerator pump in the middle hole so I probably need to move it.  When I flick the throttle linkage I hear a rush of air followed shortly by the rise in rpm so I 'think' I need a bigger fuel shot so I should use the hole closest to the air horn, does that sound right?  With normal acceleration there is no bog nor is there one when I punch it at anything above idle.  I'll miss the roar and power of the TQ but boy am I glad it's running decent again. 

Thanks again for all the help guys, I really appreciate it.   

[Charger-Bodie]

Probably wants more initial timing if you vac is low.

[Dino]

Probably wants more initial timing if you vac is low.

More than 24?  I'm going to need a really short mechanical advance then.  Maybe I should try full manifold vacuum advance?

[Charger-Bodie]

Probably wants more initial timing if you vac is low.

More than 24?  I'm going to need a really short mechanical advance then.  Maybe I should try full manifold vacuum advance?

Probably not the case if you already have 24.

[don duick]

 24 initial timing is a lot. my cam is 224/236 @50 and 20 is about the most my engine can tolerate before I have starting problems. My vacumn reading is 12  at idle in neutral. so your reading of 11 is ok. check that your total advance does not go above 36 or you will lose horsepower.  with your initial set at 24 you only need 12 degrees of mechanical advance which is not much and there is no way you can use the vacumn advance. take off your distributor cap and check the movement of the rotor button. My rotor button moves 4mm which gives me 16 degrees of mechanical advance. yours should be 3mm. to give you 12 degrees. I measured it from the tip of the rotor button (brass terminal)

[BSB67]

Vacuum always used to be in the low 15 range but for the life of me I can't get it there anymore, It's around 11, same as with the TQ although that too used to pull 15.........From idle I have a bit of a bog if I punch it but it's not nearly as bad as the one my 750 had. 


I'm looking through the FSM to figure out how to set the throttle cable but if someone can explain it I would be very grateful.  Kickdown linkage seems to be where it is.  Under light throttle it shifts into third around 47 mph.  Is that about right?

The low vacuum and bog are likely related and likely a vacuum leak. 

It should probably shift into third around 20 mph, but nobody seems to like that.

[Dino]

Good info, thanks guys!

I will do a vacuum leak check tomorrow to make sure. 

The problem is that I am not positive which cam I have as the PO couldn't remember.  He gave me some specs that matched up to what he though was in it but I keep forgetting what it is, the numbers mean very little to me.

I did set the timing per Ron's recommendations.  The engine actually sounds better if I advance it even more and rpm rises as well when I do this.  I am not opposed to retarding it and see what she does.  Don I'll measure the rotor tomorrow.

I'm sure my car used to shift to third sooner and I wouldn't mind if it did, but it's not that far off either.  I'll play with it once everything else is set up.   

[BSB67]

If it use to be 15", and now it is 11" something has changed.

[Charger-Bodie]

Dirk, did you swap intake too or just the carb?

[Dino]

Just the carb.

Here's the history since I got it:

'71 440 with Edelbrock Performer intake (non RPM) and Edelbrock 1407 Performer carb (750).  Electronic ignition with orange box and Accel coil.  Vacuum was around 15.  I say around because the idle has never been steady so neither is the vacuum.  Oh and I keep my idle around 800-850.  Again hard to read when it bounces.

The car would have a terrible bog all the time and it became hard to drive it because it was unreliable.  Hot start was pretty bad so I blocked the heat crossover and used Permatex ultra copper all around.  I knew even less back then than I do know so I never tested for vacuum leaks.  I always had vacuum advance hooked up as it ran worse without.  I tried full manifold vacuum but the car seemed to like ported a little better.

Tired of the bog I removed the 1407 and rebuilt the thermoquad that came with the car.  After learning how to set it up I got the car to give me 15-16mmHg vacuum at idle. The car ran way better with crisp throttle response and no bog anywhere.  Opening up the secondaries for the first time made me realize the potential it had.  It never ran so good.

I always had a bad fuel smell which only got marginally better with the TQ, but better it was.

Shortly after, the ignition started acting up and since the parts were looking pretty tired I decided to get the Firecore RTR system.  Unfortunately I never knew what the timing was set at.

In the year it was off the road I worked on replacing and upgrading much of the electrical and fuel system.  The old Carter fuel pump worked still but since I had installed new fuel lines and a vapor seperator I bought a Carter M4845, for  71 440.  The price was right so I thought why not?  I installed the Firecore system and set the timing to 35 total, I forgot what base was. 

Something I did made the car not as responsive as it was and idle suffered as well.  I played wiht timing and the more I advanced it, the higher the rpm went up and the better it ran, but now base timing was getting realy high.  Ron told me to set it to highest vacuum reading or 25 degrees, whichever came first.  It's set to 24.  This is when I noticed vacuum was down.

Jeff (71SE) noticed that the passenger side venturi was running fuel at idle and said there's your problem, thats why it's running rich and idling rough.  That made sense so I opened it up and played with floats and o rings.  When I was done the passenger side venturi was no longer flooding but now the driver's side was.  Thinking the carb needed a thorough rebuild again I removed it and got the 1406 to get by until I had the time to work on this carb, they do take a lot of time to set right whereas the 1406 was gone through in an hour or so.

So that's where I am now.  The cam is going bye bye next year, probably in spring, it all depends on where I am going to do my internship for school.  Still, the cam is not the only issue here, something else is off, I just don't know what.

I have a 71 intake here, the good one, but I doubt it'll be an improvement.  Still I'm not opposed to trying it.  I still have the 1407 and am also not opposed to give it another shot, but since nobody seems to have much luck with a 1407 on a 440, it may be time wasted.

The car does seem to run pretty good right now but the short gas pedal travel needs to be fixed first.  For that reason I did not take it very far today.  I don't care all that much that it doesn't spin the tires right now,  this carb is just for testing.  If I can get it to run right then great, but I hope to reuse the TQ again.  When those secondaries open my smile gets bigger.  Even with tall tires and gears it'll move pretty damn well.  I rarely ever drive on the freeway but when I went to Jeff's place about 40 minutes away I realized how happy this car is at higher speeds.  Anything above 70 and it's super happy, closer to 90 it's ecstatic.  Amazing response and great power, it goes from 70 to 90 in no time at all so I'm guessing that's when the cam is in its element.  I'd rather have it do this in the low range but it made for a nice trip nonetheless.

For whatever reason the fuel smell is way down.  It was stinking a bit today but I was playing with the mixture a lot and revving it so that was to be expected.  On the road I really couldn't smell all that much so that was excellent news.

I'm not sure what else I can do at this point but to check for vacuum leaks and measure fuel pressure. 

I'd honestly be very happy to find something wrong with either because it'll be a fairly easy fix.

I would like to try to set the distributor to get max vacuum and see how much the rpm goes up.  Then when I get it to idle right I want to see where it's at.  Is this risky?  I have a feeling it may be really high.

Also, the vacuum advance pod is currently pointing towards the front of the driver's side fender.  A bit mre and I'll be pointing at the top radiator hose.  Shouldn't it be pointing towards cylinder #1?

Jeff thinks the timing chain may have slop as the timing mark bounces a bit but I wonder if that's because the idle bounces and everything else just follows its lead.  He's probaby right though but it'll get fixed with the new cam install.

I still don't know how the linkage for the secondaries work as it prevents them from opening.  At idle I can rev the car fine, esecially at the carb, but when driving it feels like I'm running on the primaries only.  Can I test to see if the secondaries open without driving it?  My 1407 does not have this small piece of linkage.

[Charger-Bodie]

Maybe the intake gaskets are leaking?

[Dino]

Maybe the intake gaskets are leaking?

Maybe they are and you know what?  That would totally make my day because that's a real easy fix.   

Can I spray brake cleaner or wd40 on it or do I need carb cleaner specifically?  Rpm goes up if it has a leak right?

[Dino]

I sprayed brake cleaner around the base of the carb and the intake manifold without any changes.  For whatever reason the car won't idle at 850 anymore, it's either 750-ish or above 950.  I don't get it.  Car runs like crap, very little power.  Still only have an inch of gas pedal travel which I can't seem to fix. Idle is bouncing, vacuum is bouncing.  It's hard to believe this is all the cam's doing but I don't know what else to think.  I've tried everything and nothing seems to work. I think I'm done with this. I have spent so much time trying to get this car to run I'm at my wits end.  Oh yeah and it's stinking all over the place again.  

I'm pretty upset right now, I don't even want to look at the damn thing.  

I'll put in in storage in December and when it comes back out I'm removing the cam, this thing's is going back to stock.

[don duick]

I know how you feel been through this before many times. Best thing to do is forget about it. and come back later. All of my problems have usually been faulty ignition, coils and ecu, fowling plugs, lifter pump up and of course the dreaded carb. wonder how they kept them running back in the day when there were millions of these motors running as daily drivers.

[Dino]

Thanks Don, yeah I need to step back and chill.  I need the car for Saturday, I promised the members of the university organization I'm in that we could use it to attract people so we can expand the club and I would hate to let them down.  I just got fed up with it as I'm spending time I don't have trying to make it run right.  I'll just throw the TQ back on, even though the one venturi drips at idle, at least it runs alright with it.  I doubt I'd make it to college as it is now.

After that I think I'm done with it for a while.  I'll start ordering parts over the winter and will probably get rid of the headers and look for some hp manifolds.  I'm all for making cars fast if racing is what you want to do, but for a driver nothing beats stock.

[71 SE3834V]

Dirk, we need to do a compression check before you start buying parts.
Also put on the list to set the distributor drive gear to where it should be so you have more room for timing adjustment. My thinking....if who ever worked on it (replaced the cam) couldn't put the drive gear back in the right way what else could they have F'ed up.
When you had the valve covers off before did you roll the engine over and watch the rocker movement? Just asking.
Mine gave me fits trying to figure it out because the compression was pretty even in all cylinders and the vac needle didn't bounce and I had a wiped out cam!

[Dino]

I forgot about the compression test, you're right that needs to be priority.  I just ordered a 10 pack of TQ well seals and am looking for the base gasket.  That's all I'll buy for now.   

Once the TQ is back on it'll drive alright again although the venturi drips. I can come over anytime but Saturday so if there's something you need a hand with then we can work something out.  I'm in no hurry though.

Whoever reworked this engine didn't know much about tuning.  Adding one or two go fast parts without matching the rest is not the way to do it!  I wonder what I may find when I tear into this thing.

When I installed the distributor I did have the covers off to watch the rockers.  The dampner marks lined up with the rocker movement so I think that part was okay.

As much as I love the sound of this car, I can't wait for it to have a smooth idle.   On a positive note, I hooked up the air cleaner with the vacuum hoses and the pods and baffles seem to work.

Next year I'd like to replace cam and timing chain and maybe get another intake, not sure if it's worth it though.  I have the 71 model intake but it's a square bore and I need a sprea bore for the TQ.  I will paint the performer intake orange though.   

I'll leave the headers for now as they should work fine on a stock engine.  I'l replace them wih manifolds when I buy a new exhaust system.  This one will be fine for a while to come.  The cam and timing chain is much more pressing. 

[71 SE3834V]

I was concerned if you had good movement on all the rockers.
By all means, try to get that bug out of the TQ. Does the engine still have that cough/sputter thing it was doing at idle w/the new carb?

I'm just about ready to drop my car off the stands and move it out so I can move the trans out, clean it up and get it to the shop. Once the car is movable I can go pick up the engine and get it in the garage.

[Dino]

The sputter issue was during driving and the 1406 didn't sputter no.  The issue with the TQ sputter seems to be the floats.  I think I'll be able to get them right with a minor tweak, I think I may still be off the factory setting a bit but didn't want to do anything until that venturi leak was fixed.  The sputter is pretty minor now and only noticable at low speed. 

What it does at idle is the same with either carb, be it the TQ, 1406, or 1407.  No real change there.  The engine just idles like crap.  Idle now is actually worse than before yet it was real nice yesterday.  For some reason it didn't stick.  Fast idle is horrendous.  I don't know how to describe it but the rythm is off, kinda like a galloping horse. Think smacking coconuts together like in Monthy Python's Holy Grail.   

After a few minutes it settles but it's impossible to get it steady.  The 50 or so rpm it bounces with the TQ is about as good as it gets.  I' m real curious to see what cam is in this thing.

I still need to measure fuel pressure.  It may be okay since the 1406 had no venturi issue and they need about the same pressure.  I'll try to measure it Wednesday.  I thought I was done with this car but I was just pissed.  The TQ is definitely worth saving, it's a great carb but it's just a pain to set up.

Let me know if you need a hand pushing the car and parts.   

[71 SE3834V]

kinda like a galloping horse. Think smacking coconuts together like in Monthy Python's Holy Grail.   

Ha! one of my favorite movies.

The idle issue I was talking about was that cough or miss it did every once in a while. Remember I said "It's gonna do strange things, cough and not idle right with all that fuel dumping down it at idle."

I think the "galloping" you're talking about might be the engine "loping"?? You know, like a engine with a big cam and blower on it?
My car had a bit of a lope in it like it had a built engine when I first got it running in 2011. Kinda sounded nice when it was backed in under the carport but it didn't idle very smooth. Knew it wasn't quite right. Timing mark jumped around also. Found the timing chain slop was 13-15*. I figured the if the cam was running behind were it should be the valve timing would be off. Changed out the chain last year and the lope went away but the running problem was still there. Well we know the rest of the story.

If all goes well I should be running my trans in tomorrow. When I get it back maybe we can put it up in place then do a comp check on your car and jack it up and roll the crank back & forth and try to see how much slop is in the chain.

[Dino]

The first day I tried the 1406 the idle was smoother so it must've been that venturi dumping fuel.  Idle was still going up and down as it did before but it did sound better overall.  It didn't last though...

The galloping is much worse than the engine loping, that it does all the time because of the cam but when cold it sounded like all cylinders were firing at the same time, if that makes sense.  It only did this with the choke on though.  Once it warmer up it would idle back as usual.

I have new well seals, needles and jets, and a different kind of base gasket coming for the TQ.  I'm going to bolt it back on since I need the car on Saturday.

Let me know when you get the tran s back and I'll come over.   

[71 SE3834V]

Let me know when you get the tran s back and I'll come over.   

The trans is back! Only took 'em about an hour and a half! I shoulda just waited for it. Ha!
I'm a bit too sore to wrestle w/it soon and I still have the cross member to clean up.

[Dino]

Holy cow that was fast!  I can do Sunday or Monday if you like, no sure what the weather will be like.

[71 SE3834V]

Well technically I don't have it back yet.  Dropped it off at 3:30 pm and was called at 4:50 pm. Was too tired to run back out and pick it up. I will get it in the morning.
Will have to play it by ear. I want to pick up my engine this week weather permitting...

[don duick]

last time I tried different carbies I fowled the plugs by going from too lean to too rich, just a thought. Might explain the reason for your current problem.

[Dino]

last time I tried different carbies I fowled the plugs by going from too lean to too rich, just a thought. Might explain the reason for your current problem.

Good point, I'll check them.   

[Dino]

Small update:

I checked the plugs and the color is fine but they're getting old so I'll get new set. 

I put new needles and seats in the TQ as well as new well seals, but the air horn is supposed to stand proud a bit so it make a good seal when tightened down.  Well it didn't stand proud.  The TQ is back on and the driver's side venturi no longer leaks, but the passenger side is at it again.  Not as bad as before though, now it's just a drip.  I was playing with the idle mixture screw and actually got it to stop, but a few minutes later it was dripping again.  I reset the floats a bit to 1 1/16" and it cruises better but the engine really wakes up when you hit 50 or so, you can feel it pull more without adjusting the gas.  Initially there was little fuel smell and decent performance but it started to run a tad rougher and started smelling a bit again.  It's not horrible though, the car seems very reliable again despite these issues. Not a ton of power but that's expected with these problems.  It won't spin the tire for more than a few feet and only in first.  Even with 2.96 gears and wide tires it probably should do better but that's okay, i'll happen with some more work, like that shiny new cam.   

I was able to take it out on Saturday and it fired right up after sitting for about 6 hours so that was good.  It also can idle pretty low without stalling and for the first time the vacuum reading was a steady 15.  Idle still wanders a bit but it's better than before.

So I'm going to leave it as is and take it out a few more times before putting it in storage around 12/1.  When it comes back out around May I'll do the cam swap and check everything else to make sure it's good to go.

[fy469rtse]

Sorry Dino, I'm late to this one ,
Before you throw money at it, fuel pressure, are you using factory pump ?, I've seen the fuel pump push rod overlooked so many times I've lost count, this were down over time and the result is the pump is not pumping properly, arm travel is reduced
The amount of times lately that I have seen a camshaft installed using index marks on gears and not being dialed in properly , cam shaft could be at fault because of how it's not been degreed in , it's not a big cam so I would look at if its dialed in properly
Yes rebuild the TQ , great carby when there right, google or look up on how and what to look out for , mainly resin plugs in plastic bowls
Can you post a photo on your throttle cable issue , maybe we can spot what's wrong, with the edelbrock s there's a side throttle adapter they list which bolts on the side , this usually sorts out the throttle travel issues

[Dino]

Oh the Edelbrock has been removed for now.  It seems like a real good carb and in good shape as well, just not complimentary to the current build I suppose.  I do have the throttle cable adapter but the placement of the throttle cable itself is further back as opposed to the TQ.  I have another cable bracket here somewhere that may fix the issue.  When I initially rebuilt the TQ it made my engine scream, I could hear the secondaries open and this sucker would move, it does not seem to do this anymore.  It still has plenty power in the higher rpm range but not down low.  I don't think the cam is that big either but it's big enough to move that power band above 3000 rpm and with my tall gears it's not the most ideal.  I have been told by the pros here that this cam is an old grind and now it seems I may have timing chain slop as well.  Since I do want to move the power band down I think it's best just to get another cam and chain.  It's not that expensive and it'll teach me a bit more on engines.  I've never done this before.  Besides, I think that whoever built this engine may have been a bit sloppy so it's probably a good idea to check everything for that reason alone.

[1974dodgecharger]

don't know why Dino, but I just bought a 2inch spacer open style and it costs 20 bucks with gaskets hope they work.......

time to take off the hood for awhile.....

[71 SE3834V]

...it'll teach me a bit more on engines.  I've never done this before. 

Heads should be going on tomorrow and the rest of the engine assembled soon if you wanna stop by for some learning young grasshopper. 

[Dino]

don't know why Dino, but I just bought a 2inch spacer open style and it costs 20 bucks with gaskets hope they work.......

time to take off the hood for awhile.....

Dayum! What are you up to?   

...it'll teach me a bit more on engines.  I've never done this before.

Heads should be going on tomorrow and the rest of the engine assembled soon if you wanna stop by for some learning young grasshopper. 

Ha!  That sounds good to me.  I should be available any day from Friday through Monday to come give you a hand.