Advice on Gauge Cluster Rebuild/Restore

[Moparman01]

Dash is out of the Charger and stripped bare, now i have to figure out what, or how, to restore the gauge cluster. First let me say, i have never done ANY dash or gauge work ever period! Honest opinion, is it something for a first timer to just go a head and do or is it better, quicker, easier and/or more cost effective to just send the cluster out to a professional shop to be done? What kind of price is usually involved with sending out to places like Instrument Specialties or Redline Gauge Works? I'd like to go with custom white faces for the gauges like what i've seen from Redline. On the other side, what all is involved restoring the gauge cluster yourself?? My dash cluster is old and a little dirty, faces are faded and yellowed as are the lenses too. I have no way of knowing how well my old gauges work, car has been off the road for several years but the guages did work when i put the car away. I've been told that instrument restoration involves re-calibrating the gauges, something the average do it yourselfer is not capable of. My thought process is instead of paying $900 for a new set of guages, if i don't need them, why not have my originals updated/rebuilt, but i don't know if it is that simple, or even cheaper for that matter. I'm not extremely budget strapped or anything but i have to pay attention to what i'm spending, lol everyone knows these things can spiral out of control very easily!! Thanks for any advice!!

   

[b5blue]

It's all here:  http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,37999.0.html

[Moparman01]

Wow, it was even a "sticky" post and i totally missed it! Good stuff, but man there is MUCH more involved than i ever even began to imagine! Time to do some thinking...

[b5blue]

  You can do it!

[69wannabe]

I just got mine back from redline gauge works and it was a good experience for me. I had already re-faced my gauges and speedometer myself a few years back with a decal kit from performance graphic's (I think that was the name of that place) It was years several years ago when I did that and they did offer a white gauge kit too and the kit was only like $30 bucks back then. I did mine back in the black like original's and it wasn't hard to do cause my skills are pretty bad when it come's to these kind of things. I sent my cluster to redline to get the ammeter converted to a voltmeter and had all my other gauges recalibrated and he put that new solid state voltage limiter in there too and the costs was $287.00 for all of it and the gauges work great and are very accurate now compared to how they were reading before I sent it out. You can re face the gauges yourself but I just let redline do the rest. I picked up a tic toc tach a couple of years back and sent it to them for an overhaul and it was costly but it was pretty much shot too so I had it completely rebuilt. Rebuilt tach,clock, and new set shaft and they refaced it and it works perfect. That was pricey at $491.00 but a one time deal pretty much. Yeah I have about $800 bucks in it but it is the way I wan't it so that's fine with me.

[jaak]

I think rebuilding the original gauges is the way to go... it is expensive but worth it. I tried some simple test on my 69 gauges, they showed they were good... so I refaced them with some decals and decided to use them. Not long after getting my car running the Oil pressure gauge quit, and the Temp reads about 60* higher than it actually is. Right now I installed and aftermarket Oil and Temp gauge to keep tabs on everything. I plan on rebuilding the originals in this car some day.

Now my 68... I have a strict budget. I installed new gauges. I used Equuis 7000 series based on price and they are sort of factory looking (white needles/font). I spent about 185 for the tach/speedo/volt/fuel/temp/oil... and sold off the original gauges that needed rebuilt on eBay for about 85. So I got about 100 in it. Had to heavily modified the cluster housing and make mods to the bezel to make everything fit.

Cheapo 68 gauges...


Jason

[b5blue]

Hey that came out nice! 

[Skull-1]

I just got mine back from redline gauge works and it was a good experience for me. I had already re-faced my gauges and speedometer myself a few years back with a decal kit from performance graphic's (I think that was the name of that place) It was years several years ago when I did that and they did offer a white gauge kit too and the kit was only like $30 bucks back then. I did mine back in the black like original's and it wasn't hard to do cause my skills are pretty bad when it come's to these kind of things. I sent my cluster to redline to get the ammeter converted to a voltmeter and had all my other gauges recalibrated and he put that new solid state voltage limiter in there too and the costs was $287.00 for all of it and the gauges work great and are very accurate now compared to how they were reading before I sent it out. You can re face the gauges yourself but I just let redline do the rest. I picked up a tic toc tach a couple of years back and sent it to them for an overhaul and it was costly but it was pretty much shot too so I had it completely rebuilt. Rebuilt tach,clock, and new set shaft and they refaced it and it works perfect. That was pricey at $491.00 but a one time deal pretty much. Yeah I have about $800 bucks in it but it is the way I wan't it so that's fine with me.

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

[Moparman01]

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

$1500 bucks?? Does that include a new bezel panel as well?? And all new switches? Almost seems like buying a whole new set of OEM gauges for around $900 and just replacing the old guages would be easier and more cost effective. I will start taking mine apart next week and get an idea of what i have to work with, and maybe put in a call to Redline just get a ball park quote.

[Skull-1]

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

$1500 bucks?? Does that include a new bezel panel as well?? And all new switches? Almost seems like buying a whole new set of OEM gauges for around $900 and just replacing the old guages would be easier and more cost effective. I will start taking mine apart next week and get an idea of what i have to work with, and maybe put in a call to Redline just get a ball park quote.

Polishing.  Resurfacing.  Calibrating.  Repairing fried circuit board.   Quartz conversion of clock.  Upgraded volt Limiter.    Recalibration of Speedo.  Replace damaged switches.  

Basically rebuilding every inch of it.

[69wannabe]

I just got mine back from redline gauge works and it was a good experience for me. I had already re-faced my gauges and speedometer myself a few years back with a decal kit from performance graphic's (I think that was the name of that place) It was years several years ago when I did that and they did offer a white gauge kit too and the kit was only like $30 bucks back then. I did mine back in the black like original's and it wasn't hard to do cause my skills are pretty bad when it come's to these kind of things. I sent my cluster to redline to get the ammeter converted to a voltmeter and had all my other gauges recalibrated and he put that new solid state voltage limiter in there too and the costs was $287.00 for all of it and the gauges work great and are very accurate now compared to how they were reading before I sent it out. You can re face the gauges yourself but I just let redline do the rest. I picked up a tic toc tach a couple of years back and sent it to them for an overhaul and it was costly but it was pretty much shot too so I had it completely rebuilt. Rebuilt tach,clock, and new set shaft and they refaced it and it works perfect. That was pricey at $491.00 but a one time deal pretty much. Yeah I have about $800 bucks in it but it is the way I wan't it so that's fine with me.

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

I put new decals on my small gauges and the speedo but redline did the reface on the tach but I am not sure if it's paint or decals. You can e-mail or call and ask what they do when they reface gauges when they do them. I was afraid to send my cluster out there with all the switches in it so when I sent out the cluster I removed the tach, headlight switch and the dimmer/dome light switch to keep them with me since they were not needed to do what they done for my gauges. I had it wrapped in bubble wrap and more bubble wrap and then alot of packing material when I sent it to them. I cut the box back open twice and stuffed it with more packing til it didn't move at all when I shook the box around!!

[Dino]

I had a lot of fun restoring mine and I used chrome paint so I could redo the bezels real cheap.  Still looking good!   

http://www.dodgecharger.com/forum/index.php/topic,86736.0.html

[myk]

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

$1500 bucks?? Does that include a new bezel panel as well?? And all new switches? Almost seems like buying a whole new set of OEM gauges for around $900 and just replacing the old guages would be easier and more cost effective. I will start taking mine apart next week and get an idea of what i have to work with, and maybe put in a call to Redline just get a ball park quote.

So not worth it, IMO.  If you're just seeking good looks and functionality, what Jaak did for his '68 is more than adequate and arguably better...

[bill440rt]

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

$1500 bucks?? Does that include a new bezel panel as well?? And all new switches? Almost seems like buying a whole new set of OEM gauges for around $900 and just replacing the old guages would be easier and more cost effective. I will start taking mine apart next week and get an idea of what i have to work with, and maybe put in a call to Redline just get a ball park quote.

So not worth it, IMO.  If you're just seeking good looks and functionality, what Jaak did for his '68 is more than adequate and arguably better...

For some, it is.
I don't remember paying anywhere near $1500 bucks to have mine done thru Redline. And that was with a white-face conversion, voltmeter conversion, calibration, and volt limiter. Redline does not use decals. I used decals first, although they did the job I was not 100% thrilled.
Some things you can do yourself to still keep costs down. I polished the lens myself, painted the needles orange with an airbrush, and like Dino repainted the bezels with chrome paint and lettered them (of course real chrome still looks better IMHO). The switches were ok so I left them.
All depends what you want.

[comet_666]

I called instrument specialties and they told me a turn key dash would run me $6000! And that is with me sending them everything I have!
They are real nice but no that nice.

[Moparman01]

Right on Bill!! Yeah i would love to save a few bucks doing the whole thing myself but the piece of mind knowing it's done 100% correct just might be worth the extra $$$. $1500 does seem a bit high tho for what needs to be done, i could see that if i were going with all brand new gauges, i just want my factory units to function correctly and accurately and look like brand new with a slight custom touch (white faces). I haven't made up my mind yet if i'm going to send out or tackle it all myself, i might make a call to Redline and get a ballpark figure from them and go from there. Tonight i started taking the cluster apart on my work bench, gauges look like they are in very good shape, but how accurate i do not know. My bezel face is in rough shape tho, somebody re-painted it and did a horrible job, i'm already having trouble stripping the paint of the sections of dash inserts so i may be buying new. The clear lenses are pretty faded/cloudy as well, what are you guy's using to polish the plastic lenses??



Needle was broken off the whole time i used the car as a driver!

[Skull-1]

Well.....I don't know what to do then....

I want the peace of mind knowing it will be done right without any questions asked...

*sigh*

[comet_666]

Just remember, every time you are driving you have to look at the dash. For me it would be one of the last things if not the last thing I did before It was road ready but I would do it right.

[Pete in NH]

On the clear lens try the Novus Plastic Polish kit. It comes with three small bottles of polish with different abrasives. The most abrasive takes out scratches and the next two restore the clear look of the lens. Do an internet search on Novus Plastic Polish and you'll find multiple sources.

[Dino]

I think I mentioned what I used in the thread I posted.  I think it was Meguiar's plastic polish and it worked very well.

The chrome paint is almost the same as true chrome, but it's not rattle can chrome and you need to know how to paint if you want to attempt it.  One mistake and the chrome will look silver.  Real vacuum plating is always better of course but if you want to give it a shot, I paid a few bucks for the paint and did all three bezels.

[bill440rt]

You can also try Easy-Off oven cleaner or brake fluid to remove the paint off the bezels. 

[Moparman01]

I think I mentioned what I used in the thread I posted.  I think it was Meguiar's plastic polish and it worked very well.

The chrome paint is almost the same as true chrome, but it's not rattle can chrome and you need to know how to paint if you want to attempt it.  One mistake and the chrome will look silver.  Real vacuum plating is always better of course but if you want to give it a shot, I paid a few bucks for the paint and did all three bezels.

Yes you did mention the Meguiars Plastic Polish, i just forgot! I might go pick some up tonight! I think I know what chrome paint you are talking about, stuff is called Alclad and must be shot thru an airbrush? I'm big into the scale model car hobby (gets me thru the winter lol) and i've read a lot about Alclad, guys strip the model kit "plasti-chrome" off bumpers/grilles/wheels ect. and spray that stuff on for a more accurate/realistic chrome look. Cool stuff but i've never tried it, never really got into airbrushing. You are right, rattle can "chrome" paint really doesn't come out very chrome, more of a bright silver. If i can get the nasty black paint off my dash insert panels i will probably just use the rattle can chrome paint, it will look fine as long as the what thing is uniform.

[Skull-1]

Just remember, every time you are driving you have to look at the dash. For me it would be one of the last things if not the last thing I did before It was road ready but I would do it right.

It is actually.   I have spent $35K over the last 10+ years.  Everything has been done except door panels, a/c control panel, and the cluster.

Of course, now I have to find out what fried my electrical system a few months back.  I suspect my Electronic VR blew up and went full tilt....

I will be running a stock setup until I can convert the Ammeter to something safer.   Eek.

[K9COP]

[/quote]I will be running a stock setup until I can convert the Ammeter to something safer.   Eek.[/quote]

If I were you, I'd put the two ammeter wires onto one terminal on the back of the gauge (common work around for dodgy ammeters) and buy a cigarette lighter plug in voltmeter to keep you safe until you decide what to do as a permanent fix. Sounds cheesy but it works:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/12V-24V-Digital-LED-Display-Volt-Meter-Auto-Car-Cigarette-Lighter-Voltage-Gauge-/360667494249?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item53f9753769&vxp=mtr



K9

[Skull-1]

Well, I took it to a guy who knows his stuff.   We are dumping the Ammeter wires altogether from the source and will be running the Ammeter as a Voltmeter...   First thing is to try and find what fried...

[fy469rtse]

Look up VDO gauges Australia,
They have a modern amp gauge , it's wired independently , do the bypass to amp wires sticky on here,
VDO gauge fitted in behind factory face , needle sits as per factory
Next thing I would is build the test unit for ohms readings,
Check you calibration on gauges yourself , I did as per the thread, gauges ok ,
Fuel not , but that's the tank sender, another thread on that ,
Budget , you can get decals to overlay the faces , put on with care and patience won't be able to tell you have done this to them , the most common fault and the guys on here will back me, circuit board and pins to that for wiring harness connection , also on this part is the crappy voltage factory reducer for reducing volts from
12 to 5.5 volts to run gauges,
Look up charger or rt speciality s for a new circuit board with modern voltage reduction built in,
Do all this first, and if good spend the money on what you look at, repro bezels from pg classics, 
Or do the basics circuit board , this corrects most of the problems, next oil gauge, sender on engine is the usual culprit, same with fuel gauge and earthing of this

[5hunert]

Just remember, every time you are driving you have to look at the dash. For me it would be one of the last things if not the last thing I did before It was road ready but I would do it right.

It is actually.   I have spent $35K over the last 10+ years.  Everything has been done except door panels, a/c control panel, and the cluster.

Of course, now I have to find out what fried my electrical system a few months back.  I suspect my Electronic VR blew up and went full tilt....

I will be running a stock setup until I can convert the Ammeter to something safer.   Eek.

I used Alclad from my scale modeling on the dash bezel on my 64 Fury and it came out great.  But yes, you've gotta airbrush it. 

[Dino]

Just remember, every time you are driving you have to look at the dash. For me it would be one of the last things if not the last thing I did before It was road ready but I would do it right.

It is actually.   I have spent $35K over the last 10+ years.  Everything has been done except door panels, a/c control panel, and the cluster.

Of course, now I have to find out what fried my electrical system a few months back.  I suspect my Electronic VR blew up and went full tilt....

I will be running a stock setup until I can convert the Ammeter to something safer.   Eek.

I used Alclad from my scale modeling on the dash bezel on my 64 Fury and it came out great.  But yes, you've gotta airbrush it. 

That's what I did. Alclad gloss black followed by a thin coat of chrome.  When done right it looks amazing. 

[Skull-1]

What happens if I try to use my Ammeter as a voltmeter?   Will it even move the needle at all?

[Dino]

What happens if I try to use my Ammeter as a voltmeter?   Will it even move the needle at all?

No, but it'll make some smoke before the fuse pops!  The ammeter was designed to have power flow through  If you hook up one power wire and one ground, then you're shorting the system. 

You can alter the ammeter by swapping the ammeter guts with volt meter guts, but that's about it.  Since it's invisible once installed, I didn't see the point in keeping the volt meter within the ammeter housing so I simply bolted the ammeter face to the volt gauge.  Way easier and it works!  All you need is a keyed 12V source so the volt meter only works with ignition on or running.  Run a ground from the new gauge to the cluster housing and you're all set.

I need to go talk to the folks at Kinko's, they have laser printers so if I can find waterproof decal paper as they have for inkjets, then I can have decals made that will look very close in quality to the ones you buy from vendors to resotre the stock gauges.  The one I have now looks the part, but it was tricky to install.  Since I miscalculated the size, it's a tad too small so the needle is off.  When I do this I will have 20 or so on one sheet.  I don't mind sharing.

The volt gauge mod I posted is real easy to do.  Give it a shot, the volt gauge is your only investment and is less than $30.

[Skull-1]

What happens if I try to use my Ammeter as a voltmeter?   Will it even move the needle at all?

No, but it'll make some smoke before the fuse pops!  The ammeter was designed to have power flow through  If you hook up one power wire and one ground, then you're shorting the system. 

You can alter the ammeter by swapping the ammeter guts with volt meter guts, but that's about it.  Since it's invisible once installed, I didn't see the point in keeping the volt meter within the ammeter housing so I simply bolted the ammeter face to the volt gauge.  Way easier and it works!  All you need is a keyed 12V source so the volt meter only works with ignition on or running.  Run a ground from the new gauge to the cluster housing and you're all set.

I need to go talk to the folks at Kinko's, they have laser printers so if I can find waterproof decal paper as they have for inkjets, then I can have decals made that will look very close in quality to the ones you buy from vendors to resotre the stock gauges.  The one I have now looks the part, but it was tricky to install.  Since I miscalculated the size, it's a tad too small so the needle is off.  When I do this I will have 20 or so on one sheet.  I don't mind sharing.

The volt gauge mod I posted is real easy to do.  Give it a shot, the volt gauge is your only investment and is less than $30.

I will look into this.  Definitely interested in your decals.   I don't suppose I could send you an Ammeter face and pay you for the trouble?

[Dino]

What happens if I try to use my Ammeter as a voltmeter?   Will it even move the needle at all?

No, but it'll make some smoke before the fuse pops!  The ammeter was designed to have power flow through  If you hook up one power wire and one ground, then you're shorting the system. 

You can alter the ammeter by swapping the ammeter guts with volt meter guts, but that's about it.  Since it's invisible once installed, I didn't see the point in keeping the volt meter within the ammeter housing so I simply bolted the ammeter face to the volt gauge.  Way easier and it works!  All you need is a keyed 12V source so the volt meter only works with ignition on or running.  Run a ground from the new gauge to the cluster housing and you're all set.

I need to go talk to the folks at Kinko's, they have laser printers so if I can find waterproof decal paper as they have for inkjets, then I can have decals made that will look very close in quality to the ones you buy from vendors to resotre the stock gauges.  The one I have now looks the part, but it was tricky to install.  Since I miscalculated the size, it's a tad too small so the needle is off.  When I do this I will have 20 or so on one sheet.  I don't mind sharing.

The volt gauge mod I posted is real easy to do.  Give it a shot, the volt gauge is your only investment and is less than $30.

I will look into this.  Definitely interested in your decals.   I don't suppose I could send you an Ammeter face and pay you for the trouble?

I wouldn't be opposed to it but I haven't gotten the decals yet.  They'll be very easy to apply though.  All you need to do to the face is make a small cut in the bottom (out of sight when installed) and drill two small holes.  Then just stick the decal on and done.  When I have the decals I'll send you a few.  If it doesn't work out then you can send me the face and I'll give it a shot.   

[Skull-1]

Fair enough.   Have a feeling I am going to destroy this gauge face trying to remove it....

[Dino]

Fair enough.   Have a feeling I am going to destroy this gauge face trying to remove it....

Use a small grinder, like a dremel, to grind down the back of the rivets and the face will pop right off.  You'll be surprised how easy it is.

[Skull-1]

Did Redline repaint them or use decals?

I sent mine to some other place and it is gonna be almost $1500 not to mention a new headlight switch I have to provide since mine was broken during shipment.

$1500 bucks?? Does that include a new bezel panel as well?? And all new switches? Almost seems like buying a whole new set of OEM gauges for around $900 and just replacing the old guages would be easier and more cost effective. I will start taking mine apart next week and get an idea of what i have to work with, and maybe put in a call to Redline just get a ball park quote.

So not worth it, IMO.  If you're just seeking good looks and functionality, what Jaak did for his '68 is more than adequate and arguably better...

Worth it to me.   This thing is gorgeous.  You get what you pay for.  I am stoked.

[HPP]

Dakota Digital is offering a new gauge cluster for 2nd gen Chargers for just under a grand that is all new and compatible with multiple wiring systems. All you need to supply is a bezel.

http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=939/category_id=679/mode=prod/prd939.htm

[Skull-1]

Dakota Digital is offering a new gauge cluster for 2nd gen Chargers for just under a grand that is all new and compatible with multiple wiring systems. All you need to supply is a bezel.

http://www.dakotadigital.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=939/category_id=679/mode=prod/prd939.htm

Nice option for those who want to customize.   I just happen to be a fan of the factory look.    But for a grand that's not a bad option there...

[HANDM]

I wouldn't mind aftermarket gauges that are accurate but after staring at the originals for 20 years, I feel it would take another 20 years to get used to it..... 

[Skull-1]

I still want to know if there is a way to mimic the Ammeter's function without using the factory power wiring.    It is helpful to know if I am charging or discharging....unless there's a better way to know my alternator went kablooey. 

[Dino]

I still want to know if there is a way to mimic the Ammeter's function without using the factory power wiring.    It is helpful to know if I am charging or discharging....unless there's a better way to know my alternator went kablooey. 

Look up Nacho's ammeter wiring mod.  It keeps the ammeter but makes it a bit safer.  I didn't want to take the chance nor did I see a need for an ammeter.  Besides, once you run a wire from the alternator to the starter relay the ammeter won't read correct anyway.  I'm much happier with a volt meter in there. 

Of course you could install the voltmeter but keep the stock face as is.  As long as you know where the 12 to 14 volt range is then you'll know what the battery status is.