70 charger starting and electrical issues

[Charger_70]

All i have is a tester that lights up if it has 6v to 12v .I hook it to ground and lights up if  wire has power.

[Charger_70]

Ok. I think im understanding . On starter relay it has a wire from battery  and the green wire on the same post. Take of green wire and the wire from my fuse holder connect one end to starter relay and the other end to the green wire and then take another fuse holder and put one end to green wire and the other end to yellow wire and the 15 amp fuse will go there right?

[b5blue]

  Both yellow and green "start" at the post with fuses, you want to get rid of extra patches and connections.
 Get a meter. One for 8 bucks at Walmart is fine. You'll need it for any old car, more so the Charger! Order an FSM, disk version is like 30 bucks online.
That big relay hanging down above the Emr. brake is your headlight door control relay, take care of and with it. New Old Stock (NOS) go for 400.00 and reproduction ones are 75-80 buck if you can even find one. (They are on backorder for over 6mo. and may never be available again for all we know.)
 If you don't have the money right now save up, we'll wait! Many Mopars have been lost to some of the crap you are messing with right now! If we can be sure how to help you much can be bypassed safely to get the car running but a cheap meter is mandatory, we can explain how and where to use it. (You'll be looking for resistance in wires, a sign of hidden problems.) 

[Charger_70]

  Both yellow and green "start" at the post with fuses, you want to get rid of extra patches and connections.
 Get a meter. One for 8 bucks at Walmart is fine. You'll need it for any old car, more so the Charger! Order an FSM, disk version is like 30 bucks online.
That big relay hanging down above the Emr. brake is your headlight door control relay, take care of and with it. New Old Stock (NOS) go for 400.00 and reproduction ones are 75-80 buck if you can even find one. (They are on backorder for over 6mo. and may never be available again for all we know.)
 If you don't have the money right now save up, we'll wait! Many Mopars have been lost to some of the crap you are messing with right now! If we can be sure how to help you much can be bypassed safely to get the car running but a cheap meter is mandatory, we can explain how and where to use it. (You'll be looking for resistance in wires, a sign of hidden problems.) 

so what i mentioned above that is what im needing to do?

[Pete in NH]

Ok. I think im understanding . On starter relay it has a wire from battery  and the green wire on the same post. Take of green wire and the wire from my fuse holder connect one end to starter relay and the other end to the green wire and then take another fuse holder and put one end to green wire and the other end to yellow wire and the 15 amp fuse will go there right?

Yes, that will work. OR put both fuse holder wires to the starter relay stud. The 50 amp one will go to the green wire and the 15 amp one will go to the yellow wire. This is what Neal suggested and it will clean up the wiring a little.

As Neal said you will need to get a cheap little test meter. One from Wallmart or Harbor Freight will be fine. We can not really tackle the ignition switch with out that test meter.

[Charger_70]

Ok it has been done. Ive 2 fuse holders and put 1 end from both fuse holders on the starter relay. The other end of 1 fuse holder i hooked the green wire to it and the end of the green wire runs straight to bulkhead. The other end of the 2nd fuse holder i hooked to yellow wire and the other end of the yellow wire runs straight to the push button. Now there is another wire thats behind push button and it leads to starter itself is this wire ok? Now both fuse holders are in and still no start. This morn with 1 fuse holder it would start but it would blow the fuse and would quit . Now with both fuse holders on  it does just like before if i keep movin 2 wires it act like its goin too but nothing.

[Pete in NH]

There should be only two wires to the starter. One is a very heavy battery cable to the positive side of the battery. This cable is on the biggest stud on the starter. The second wire to the starter is on the smaller stud on the starter and should go to the stater relay on the fire wall. Those are the only two wires that should be on the starter. Are you saying you have more than these two wires?

[Charger_70]

There should be only two wires to the starter. One is a very heavy battery cable to the positive side of the battery. This cable is on the biggest stud on the starter. The second wire to the starter is on the smaller stud on the starter and should go to the stater relay on the fire wall. Those are the only two wires that should be on the starter. Are you saying you have more than these two wires?

I checked there are only 2 wires goin to starter BUT  the 1 going from relay to starter has a splice in middle and it goes to behind the push button.

[Charger_70]

Well car started and the one of the 2 wires you have to put together got HOT again ... So out of frustration i traced these 2 wires to there location. The solid red 1 that has power  leads to behind the bulkhead but there are a couple wires spliced into it but its not the one that gets hot on me. The other wire that has no power on it I traced it to a bunch of wires that look like they have been welded together on the ends or a really strong glue cause the ends wont move. On this wire there is a red and black wire comin from direction of firewall and there are 2 wires comin from inside the car and then theres the black wire that comes from them and thats the wire that gets HOT there are together .. the black wire has a splice on the end and they added a red wire to make it longer.

[Charger_70]

You think they tried to bypass ammeter and have done it wrong?

[b5blue]

Your kinda "jumping ahead" by going right into starting the engine. Pete and I were trying get the wires sorted and safe first. No matter, if you jump the battery + to the resistor you'll hot wire bypassing the key. Use the pushbutton to crank it should run off the battery. If it keeps running you will have to undo the jumper to shut it off.  

[Charger_70]

Your kinda "jumping ahead" by going right into starting the engine. Pete and I were trying get the wires sorted and safe first. No matter, if you jump the battery + to the resistor you'll hot wire bypassing the key. Use the pushbutton to crank it should run off the battery. If it keeps running you will have to undo the jumper to shut it off.  

Ok what am I looking for when I do this? What is next? Im hoping to get car running and the 1 wire not get hot. If the car will run without getting hot then i will leave the push button at the moment but will change soon. Kinda go back and forth from working on this to brakes

[Charger_70]

Ok i ran jumper and car almost started. Battery weak so im charging it but i believe it was goin to start if it had another good crank and that was without key and holding 2 wires together .

[Charger_70]

Also i was wanting to mention. Ive looked at diagrams of bypass ammeter and one thing i noticed is there is a fuseble link goin from alternator to starter relay and mine doesnt have 1 it just runs straight from alternator to starter relay.

[b5blue]

Never start the car without a fully charged battery. I can't stress that enough, all these problems could be from someone thinking that the car could recharge a low battery just one time and that is a BIG NO NO!
  By jumping you will just run off battery leave R/B wires apart and taped off (No exposed copper or connections anyplace.) Your just going to see if the engine will keep running for more than a few minutes. You'll still be monitoring for hot wires or other problems so set the emergency brake firmly and be careful. 

[Pete in NH]

Also i was wanting to mention. Ive looked at diagrams of bypass ammeter and one thing i noticed is there is a fusible link goin from alternator to starter relay and mine doesnt have 1 it just runs straight from alternator to starter relay.

David,

Yes, we know there is no fusible link. We saw that in the pictures you sent. That is why we had you add the 50 amp fuse. The 50 amp fuse takes the place of the fusible link. The fuses we had you add will not fix the starting problems but , will keep your car safe while they are being fixed.

We have many more things to look at and fix before the car will start and run properly. From your pictures the wiring has been badly cut up and we need to get things back to where they should be.

You said there is a wire from the push button that is spliced into the wire from the starter relay to the starter. That should be a heavy brown wire and it should not have anything spliced into it. Disconnect the wire from the push button and use electrical tape to cover the bare spot on the brown wire. Also, tape the end of the push button wire. Lets start to fix  the wiring and but it back to what it should be.

[Charger_70]

Ok. The diagram showed a fuseble link right at the alternator. It also showed the 1 you guys had me to add. Whats next that i need to do?

[Pete in NH]

Hi David,

Lets make sure the fuses are in the right place before we go any further to make sure the wiring is protected from fire danger. Can you post a picture of the fuses you put in?

Also, we are at a point where we will need that test meter to look for short circuits. Did you get a meter yet?

Lets try to get the starter relay system working. Then we can move on to the ignition system. At that point the car should start and run. Then we can tackle the charging system.

Look at my last post about that extra wire spliced into the wire from the starter relay to the starter.

[Charger_70]

Will do.Is the meter i have ok? It just shows what wire has power and what dont it shows if a wire has 6v or 12v. I will try to get pics this afternoon. The reason i was wondering bout the alternator wire is it leads to the bulkhead and the diagram i looked at shows it connected to the starter relay with a fuseble link .

[Charger_70]

Hi David,

Lets make sure the fuses are in the right place before we go any further to make sure the wiring is protected from fire danger. Can you post a picture of the fuses you put in?

Also, we are at a point where we will need that test meter to look for short circuits. Did you get a meter yet?

Lets try to get the starter relay system working. Then we can move on to the ignition system. At that point the car should start and run. Then we can tackle the charging system.

Look at my last post about that extra wire spliced into the wire from the starter relay to the starter.
[/quo The wire that goes from starter relay to the starter and had a splice in it with a wire going from the push button to it. I took it off and taped it off but the car won't crank. There are 2 wires from that push button 1 goes to starter relay which i put a 15 amp fuseble link on and the 2nd wire was spliced in with the wire going from starter relay to starter. That i just removed but it won't crank.

[Charger_70]

http://i876.photobucket.com/albums/ab322/scar_face_22/005-1.jpg

[Pete in NH]

Okay on the fuses they look like they are in the right places. You could shorten the green wire to the fuse holder to make things a little more neat.

Yes, I know once you disconnected that wire tapped into the starter relay to starter wire the car would no longer crank. I think the way it was connected someone had used the push button to completely wire around the starter relay. That was not a good thing to do. There is way too much current in that circuit for the push button and it messes up the ignition start circuit We will be putting the starter relay back in the way it should be wired.

The next thing I need to know is if the car has an automatic transmission or is a manual.

We can go a few more steps with your test light but, very soon you will need a real meter. So, look to buy or borrow one.

[Charger_70]

Okay on the fuses they look like they are in the right places. You could shorten the green wire to the fuse holder to make things a little more neat.

Yes, I know once you disconnected that wire tapped into the starter relay to starter wire the car would no longer crank. I think the way it was connected someone had used the push button to completely wire around the starter relay. That was not a good thing to do. There is way too much current in that circuit for the push button and it messes up the ignition start circuit We will be putting the starter relay back in the way it should be wired.

The next thing I need to know is if the car has an automatic transmission or is a manual.

We can go a few more steps with your test light but, very soon you will need a real meter. So, look to buy or borrow one.

It is automatic.  Ifound another wire connected to starter relay there is a red wire that comes from ignition switch and it connect to another red wire but there is a blue wire spliced in with them and it runs to starter relay and it is spliced to a brown with yellow trim wire.. On diagram it shows that the brown and yellow wire goes to neutral safety switch ?? I also took my gauge cluster and checked alternator gauge and hooked up the red and black wire to it to see if it done anything and when i turn key on the needle on gauge went to the left slightly and when i turn key off it goes back to middle.

[Pete in NH]

David,

It's good to know the ammeter works and we can connect it, if you want to when we get to the charging circuit.

The brown/yellow wire ( the yellow stripe is called a tracer) is the neutral safety switch wire on an automatic trans. car. Are you saying it is spliced in with other wires? It should go to its own terminal on the starter relay.

The brown-yellow wire should go from the center pin of the neutral safety switch on the transmission to a pin on the starter relay. There should not be anything else connected to this wire.

[Charger_70]

David,

It's good to know the ammeter works and we can connect it, if you want to when we get to the charging circuit.

The brown/yellow wire ( the yellow stripe is called a tracer) is the neutral safety switch wire on an automatic trans. car. Are you saying it is spliced in with other wires? It should go to its own terminal on the starter relay.

The brown-yellow wire should go from the center pin of the neutral safety switch on the transmission to a pin on the starter relay. There should not be anything else connected to this wire.

Yes a blue wire is spliced from red wire from ignition switch and other end of blue wire is spliced to brown and yellow tracer wire and the end of the brown and yellow wire connects to starter relay