settle me and buddies arguement.

[Cooter]

So how fast could YOU go in a typical  full steel, B body Mopar,  for limited funds. Say, like $20,000.00 in the whole car. (Used to be in our racing club, 10k, but the cost of buying an older mopar has gone up) NOT interested in uber high dollar resto's, just decent drivers with little rust here and there. (No rat rod muscle cars that seem to be the in thing either)

No Nitrous ....would like to hear from pump fuel, all motor car.

My buddy claims I can't run high tens, low 11's for under $35k. You know the old addage, "hell, the drivetrain will cost you $25k"...

This is assuming you know a little bout repairs/tuning and do not have to pay "your guy" to tune it.

I still think it can be done.
so, if YOU had to do this, what is YOUR recipe? Reliable? Race only?

[cdr]

find a good 4 door b body & the rest would be no problem   if it has to be a 2 door just weld the rear doors shut.   

[cdr]

440 stock stroke, alum heads,port myself,solid flat tappet cam, gut the car .

[Cooter]

See, this is good Charlie. I wasn't even thinkin bout 4dr stuff. That's points there.
What about gear? Could it still be driven reasonably?
I would think a high ten 1/4 mile car could still be driven on the street without a rollback and a fuel tanker on call.

[cdr]

i think it could be very streetable, 4.10 gear,although it would be a VERY ugly car with no frills,used parts ,, you know dirty white boy stuff 

[Daytona R/T SE]

.

[6spd68]

i think it could be very streetable, 4.10 gear,although it would be a VERY ugly car with no frills,used parts ,, you know dirty white boy stuff 

Isn't that our favorite 

[moparsr2fast]

10s with a 25 k buget?  Yes sir.. it can be done if itdoesn't need to double as a show poodle.

4:30 gear, built automatic with a decent convertor, middle of the road stroke... ie 440  =  472 ( welded crank),  hand ported rpm heads, good roller hydraulic roller cam, and stick it all in an old dart. Then hang on!! 

[Cooter]

B body, full steel fellas....

[moparsr2fast]

  Would a 66/67 satellite or coronet work?   Spend some $ to get her to hook, caltracs,  sub frame connectors...

Use a 400 block. Get the bobweight to that of a small block chevy.

 Lose the interior, door guts, heater core ect... lighten her up as much as possible.

 Some people used to run ducts from the hi beams to the aircleaner.  

http://pages.ebay.com/motors/link/?nav=item.view&id=191088472132

[el dub]

There was at one time a Direct Connection magazine like catalog that could take your car down into the nines with just bolt on stuff and head porting on the 906 heads. Plus it showed how to port the heads with templates I think. So yes it could be done. They showed steps to go from the 14's down to the nines or tens I forget.

[Ponch ®]

i think it could be very streetable, 4.10 gear,although it would be a VERY ugly car with no frills,used parts ,, you know dirty white mexican boy stuff 

there, fixed it for ya 

[Ponch ®]

and why is no one mentioning late 3rd gens? You can pick up a decent shape 73/74 Charger/Satellite for a couple of grand, the rest goes into the motor / suspension.

[moparsr2fast]

and why is no one mentioning late 3rd gens? You can pick up a decent shape 73/74 Charger/Satellite for a couple of grand, the rest goes into the motor / suspension.

  Close to #1000 weight difference...

[Ponch ®]

and why is no one mentioning late 3rd gens? You can pick up a decent shape 73/74 Charger/Satellite for a couple of grand, the rest goes into the motor / suspension.

  Close to #1000 weight difference...

SHUT THE F...RONT DOOR!

For real? 1000?

[JB400]

Personally, I'd look at a 64/65 model b body.  6 cyl. torsion bars.  Altered wheelbase (never said anything about chassis mods )  gutted interior, battery in the trunk, 3 spd auto (unless your Ronnie Sox)  440 with stroker crank, 6 pack carb setup, no windows, no dash, 6 pt. rollcage, Ford 9 inch or Mopar 8 3/4 with 4.30 gears.

I say you could dip into the 10's.

[moparsr2fast]

 

and why is no one mentioning late 3rd gens? You can pick up a decent shape 73/74 Charger/Satellite for a couple of grand, the rest goes into the motor / suspension.

  Close to #1000 weight difference...

SHUT THE F...RONT DOOR!

For real? 1000?

 Actually, it is much more like 600 pounds, but in a car you are trying to get to haul a%&, 600 pounds is quite a bit to compensate for in $. It is my understanding that every 100 lbs is worth 2 tenths in a quarter. That means all else being equal, a good second or slower in the 3rd gen.

[cdr]

100 lbs is closer to 1 tenth

lmao ponch 

[cdr]

lets pick an obtainable weight, say 3600 lbs with driver maybe less, but stick to that,for it to run 10.80's its gonna need 565 hp at the crank.  that would be very close to what my engine should make on a bad air day,i am gonna have about 7000.00 in my 511 low deck complete.  that leaves  a lot for the rest of the junker.

[Baldwinvette77]

Hmmmmm so many ways to do this if you are me 

[Steve P.]

I agree on a 64' - 65'. I had a pile of used race parts in my first 65' Coronet 500. It had no interior and I was in the service, so no money to spend on good parts. Also was not very good putting together a good combo. (Didn't know Ron back then)!!  

I never swiss cheesed the car, but was pretty lite and I was running mid 11's in the 1/4.

So if I had $20,000.00 and could buy as much as possible from others used goodies, absolutely.

Years ago a buddy and I built a Chevy Wagon that we swiss cheesed and built a 2x4 steel frame for. We put together a small block for it and chopped and shortened the car. It ran in the 10's right off the trailer...
Here is that car a few years ago with just a few (lol) alterations.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRjpT_DML_Q

[Ponch ®]

100 lbs is closer to 1 tenth

lmao ponch 

white boys aint the only ones that like going to junkyards 

[Cooter]

I'm was thinkin more along the lines of around 3830-4000 lb B body, as myself and full tank of fuel usually puts a full street car (not ness. A stripped out car) up around that mark. I still say high tens would be doable without a banker backing you.

[Steve P.]

You would have to actually make a CODE like set of boundaries. Ot like a racing class.

Weight
CI.
Tire size
ALL steel
new or used part
So on...

Otherwise everyone is simply putting together the lightest possible car.

I bet I could get a 65' B-body down under 3000 with a big block and full tank of gas... Every bit of the car would be lightened up and no hinges. I would use tape to hold down the sheet of skin that use to be a hood. Only 1 door would open and it would be 2 steel nuts and steel wire to hang the outer skin only. Chopped to a very low height. Plastic windows. 14" aluminum skinnies up front with skinny race tires. 10 x 30 slicks on aluminum out back. Welded in and tied tubular K-member with Rack & Pinion. Rear sump truck oil pan. Drilled brakes. No inner fender wells up front. Battery to trunk. No alternator. plastic light weight cooling fan on a switch. Aluminum electric water pump on a switch. All hinges gone. Aluminum bumper brackets if we have to have steel bumpers. No bright work or extra frills. Grill filler to keep air flow from under the hood while going down the track. GUTTED of course. 8 3/4 or 9" rear end for weight savings and cheaper gear selection. Low as it can go to cut through the air.

If this is to go in the 10's it will need a cage, so also a minimum would have to be set for that as well. 

[RallyeMike]

So what you really want to know is how quick, not how fast.

I'm going 170 for about $13k. Lessee... if my math is right, that would be $76.5/mph, or $20,000 - 261mph. That's how it works, right? 

[Todd Wilson]

318 and under hood super charger?!   


Todd

[Nwcharger]

20k is a hell of a budget. I'm planning a budget Drag car that should hit 10's or at least 11's and hope to be under 10k. I bought a 2003 hyundai accent for 300 dollars that needed work from a customer the service shop I worked for. Put 250 into it and traded it straight across at a small used car lot for a 2 door 69 coronet 440 trim 318 (no motor or trans) Then picked up a motorhome for 200 dollars for the 440 and it was a 69hp 440. Then got ahold of a local guy for some valve covers and walked away with an 18 spline 4 speed crash box with scatter shield, flywheel and a hurst vertigate shifter for 700. Then i bought a weiand cross ram intake with sixpack top and carbs 1000. The car needs a cage, slicks and brake work but no bodywork besides a lift of hood and maybe a cheap f6 paint job. So far I'm in it 2450 and have quiet a bit of the big items for a fast car. Also have a couple truck Dana's and may modify one if I can't find a b-body one for a decent price. With a remaining budget of 7550 I think it can be done. 

[BROCK]

Nwcharger = the Barter King

[Cooter]

While I'm sure somewhere there's someone who can run low 10's with a car that was left to them in a will when a relative passed with $20k to boot.

That's not really what the arguement was about here. Having to buy most everything, I still say it could be done.

[moparsr2fast]

While I'm sure somewhere there's someone who can run low 10's with a car that was left to them in a will when a relative passed with $20k to boot.

That's not really what the arguement was about here. Having to buy most everything, I still say it could be done.

 Anyone with a very good knowledge of these cars, and some track time could build a 10 sec. ride with a 20k budget.  Some of the contestants on Pinks put together some pretty fast cars, and many of them were NOT purty...

[Steve P.]

I remember a few years back at Mopars At The Strip, a Cuda that had been rolled. No clue if he rolled it after building it or used a cheap body, but that thing looked horrible but went pretty damned fast!! Not that I would build a rolled body, but I bet that body could be had for next to nothing.. lol... 

[Troy]

Simple: ignore the stupid B Body limitation and build a Duster. If you don't care what kind of car it is then why limit it to B bodies? I honestly have no idea why people try to fight physics so much when it comes to racing. How about we build a mud truck using a Ferrari? Or a tow vehicle out of a CRV? Can it be done? Sure. But what's the point? I'm not going to try to live with a 10 second car on the street and, since I drive all the time, any money I spend on the "race car" is wasted. Soooo, if I had a race car it'd be dirt cheap and if I wanted it to go faster I'd start chopping stuff off to save weight. I'd never do it with a car I actually liked.

Troy

[Steve P.]

^^^^^   

In that case a Plymouth Arrow!!!!   

[Cooter]

Simple: ignore the stupid B Body limitation and build a Duster. If you don't care what kind of car it is then why limit it to B bodies? I honestly have no idea why people try to fight physics so much when it comes to racing. How about we build a mud truck using a Ferrari? Or a tow vehicle out of a CRV? Can it be done? Sure. But what's the point? I'm not going to try to live with a 10 second car on the street and, since I drive all the time, any money I spend on the "race car" is wasted. Soooo, if I had a race car it'd be dirt cheap and if I wanted it to go faster I'd start chopping stuff off to save weight. I'd never do it with a car I actually liked.

Troy

The limits of the B body are exactly the point. Anybody can go fast, even cheap, with a 500 hp engine in a go kart.
"But what's the point?". Even my buddy knows that one.
Sure driving your Charger daily, with all the morons on the road is your choice, but "what's the point?"...
why not just leap frog on over to crotch rockets? I mean anybody can go fast on one of those but, "what's the point?"..
At least this thread ain't got atheists, southern Baptists, and the undecided going at it, but "what's the point?" Right?
Anyway, back on topic. My buddy swears having to buy most everything, he seems to think it cannot be done.

[moparsr2fast]

  Are you going to award the 20k to the guy with the most likely ideas to build it for you Cooter?  Some people love the build/challenge more then the car itself. Then you can collect the car after it is done, collect the wager money with your bud, and split it with the builder. I wonder how many ideas would come up under that situation...

[Cooter]

Uh....no. no money to be made here, if it was, I'd be done built it to prove my point.

[Steve P.]

I think it is very possible. As long as it doesn't have to be pretty. Doesn't have to be top of the line anything and the builder was not getting paid. If all it had to do was break into the 10's and didn't have to stay together very long, absolutely. Especially if you can buy used parts.. Slicks, wheels, heads, headers, Intake and so on...

Hell, I have a truck Dana 60 in the shop with 4:10's in it and another 8 3/4 next to it for the ends and perches. 2 years ago I bought a 4-door 65' coronet for 100 bucks. I sold the engine for 300 and stripped what I needed from it. That car would have been perfect. It was already lightened due to rot!! An aluminum drive shaft from a truck. Channel the K-member for a non-power rack. Remove all glass but the windshield. Swiss cheese the daylights out of it once the 8 point cage is installed. Drop it close to the ground. Lose the charging system. Banana seat and a sissy bar... lol... 

This sounds like fun!!!!!! 

[Troy]

After further thought on the matter... if you buy everything then it will be a money pit. Your choices are to start with a car no one wants OR one that's a raggedy pile so you can get it cheap (OR both!). On top of that, you better be good at sourcing parts from a junkyard (I'm assuming leftover parts in your garage aren't allowed). Also, do you have to count your labor?

Here's a simpler and easier solution: buy someone else's race car. There are lots of them for sale at any given time and they've already been modified and taken the price hit. Most won't come with a motor so you can build what you want with whatever you have left.

I waste money on a lot of stuff that other people would find dumb - but I don't get in arguments about the proper way to waste my money.

Troy

[Cooter]

He finally come around after seeing for himself. I found a base 318 Coronet. He found a 440 block.
I told him he should go with one of the stroker builds here. He wants it to be reliable and a high ten car.
not to worried right now bout mpg. Just wants a solid old "American muscle".

I think (with my help) F&P Performance can put this thing in the tens for $20k and maybe still look good. At least I got him away from yet, another small block Nova.

[Steve P.]

HAHAHAHAHAHA....  Small block Nova....   

I have a buddy here that builds race car chassis. He is damn good and fast and his price is better than I ever hear from anywhere else. He tells me all the time how a build is a build. He doesn't care what brand. So then I ask: So why are you alllllways building Chevies? He says: Because no one knows how to build a Mopar or Ford!! hahahaha...

[c00nhunterjoe]

You mean one of these??

^^^^^   

In that case a Plymouth Arrow!!!!   

[Steve P.]

I sure do!!!! 

Me and my Arrow........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fWp_Cs4pYBk