water-methanol injection system

[66chargertoy]

Getting ready to order some parts for the car, and was wondering if anyone has tried water-methanol injection system on their naturally aspired big block in order to help with detonation. It would seem that Snow Performance has this segment of the market well covered for a variety of applications. Also claims that you can run a larger timing curve. The kit shown here, Snow Performance Boost Cooler Stage-2 Water/Methanol Injection Systems 20020MC, sounds like the one that would work on my build. Sells for around $600. Or am I wasting my time and money  .
Thank you in advance for your time.
Denis

[chargd72]

These are typically more practical for boosted engines.  I'm sure there are cheaper/more efficient ways to alleviate your detonation issues.

[2Luke2]

I have read people that have used them effectively on NA engines, but I personally don't know a lot about them. I don't even know how long you can go without having to stop to fill up the injection system. Would you have to carry around the mix with you in a jug in the trunk or back seat?

[cudaken]

Dennie's, they will help with compression issues. I ran water injection way back when gas first went to hell. I had 12.5 static and Sunco gas stations went out of business and we where all scrambling to find better gas.

Car felt a little stronger (could have just been in my head) but it did not knock.  I did pull back advances a little before I added the water injection. Never made a pass with the system, when I was at the track they had Cam 2 so I did not bother.

$600.00 sounds some what steep?  Guess I should read the details of the system before I judge. 

Does it work, yes.  Is it worth $600.00? 

Cuda Ken



   

[66chargertoy]

I guess that IS the inherent question. Is it worth it Or maybe just spent a little bit more and get some aluminum heads

[fy469rtse]

Go the alloy heads first, yes it does work sort of like aspirin after a big night, just takes the edge off but you still feel like crap,

[HPP]

What's is cost to remove, tear down, rebore an engine, and put new pistons in it after you detonate a set apart?

Sure, back in 1980 an Edelbrock Varajection system could be picked up for a couple hundred bucks. Based on current inflation, that comes out to around $575 today, so they aren't far off.

There is a recent article in Mopar Muscle about the snow system. Even on a set up that was not detonating, it added around 15 horses to the wheels by producing a denser charge. If your on the edge of detonating, it might be just enough to make a marginal set up live. I've got one set aside for my 360, but I don't have it all hooked up yet.

Windshield washer fluid typically has enough methanol in it to be used as injection fluid. However, Snow does provide a pretty decent warranty if you use their "Boost Juice".

[fy469rtse]

Yep if you do add that , use methonal based windscreen fluid works great

[Cooter]

$600.00........
Hummmm, I do have an extra old Nitrous plate.....an old washer pump and reservior.....
I'm thinking for around $50.00, I can make this water injection set up....

[J.Bond]

Read the same article on the Snow system. Mentioned it to my neighbor last Saturday, and he replied ,I have one on the bench right now. He is going to install it before spring. Running a two stage, twin turbo Cummings. His kit came in at 900.00, yeah a little expensive, however, Snow claims on gasoline engines, it will somewhat raise the compression ratio, raise the octane level and clean the combustion chamber. I guess what it comes down to, is a denser charge. My neighbor's big complaint, is the size of the reservoir, and where he will have to mount it. As for windshield washer fluid, I was told last week also, that it works OK but there is an amount of detergent in washer fluid and will do damage to a motor, has anyone else been told that. After reading the article, I am intrigued, and probably try one out.

[firefighter3931]

Or maybe just spent a little bit more and get some aluminum heads :icon_smile_big

You answered your own question Denis  

You know my feelings on this subject  



Ron

[cudaken]

Ron, why do you dislike water injection? 

Ken

[Kern Dog]

The $600 is a hard bill to accept. If it were spent to only gain 16 HP, thats a piss poor return on investment.
If the kit were to stop detonation, allowing  knock-free performance which may make much more than 16 HP, that starts to make sense.

[cudaken]

Red, if you are looking for every HP you can find it maybe worth the $600.00.

I read a article on line where they installed the Snow System on a 67 Chevy? Besides the extra HP car had better mid range throttle responses and gas mileage went from 13.5 MPG to 18.2.

Water injection has been around for decades. WWII military aircraft used it to boost HP. So it does work, is it worth $600? If the article claim I read is right and you could get a extra 3 to 5 more MPG I would say. But, just because it is in print does not mean it is true.

Ken 

[firefighter3931]

Ron, why do you dislike water injection? 

Ken

I don't dislike it Ken.....but for an iron head 440 it's just a bandaid fix that is being used to mask the real problem. It's a poor return on investment vs doing it right by installing a nice set of closed chamber aluminum heads with much better flow and power potential. 


Ron

[J.Bond]

Ron

So what if, you have gone the distance and have, replaced the cylinder heads with aluminum(Source 440), do not have or suffer any detonation. And really would like to see some better mpg, would you still say no to the system?

James

[2Luke2]

Ron

So what if, you have gone the distance and have, replaced the cylinder heads with aluminum(Source 440), do not have or suffer any detonation. And really would like to see some better mpg, would you still say no to the system?

James

We will definitely be looking at a system when we move from Colorado Springs to Florida.

[firefighter3931]

Ron

So what if, you have gone the distance and have, replaced the cylinder heads with aluminum(Source 440), do not have or suffer any detonation. And really would like to see some better mpg, would you still say no to the system?

James

Hi James,

I didn't mean to say that i don't like the meth injection if that's the way it sounded.  I think it's a good system but not cost effective in Denis' case and his motivation for using it was/is to combat a detonation issue. For the money....spending extra on a nice set of closed chamber aluminum heads that will add 50-60hp is a better use of resources and will accomplish the same goal. 

To answer your question ; I don't see a problem running it on  an aluminum head build for peace of mind but i'm not sure that the return on investment would be worth it....maybe-maybe not ?

Most guys that run it have a boosted application where cylinder pressure spikes and use it for detonation control. 


Ron