Trouble shooting leak in power steering

[XH29N0G]

I see posts on power steering leaks, but I know little about how the system works.  Is anyone willing to guide me on where the most likely places are for a leak of power steering fluid?  My 70 charger has a pretty substantial leak, and I want to sort it out as soon as possible.  I am trying to get an idea of how difficult this might be.

Thanks in advance for any help.

[Finn]

I think the easiest way is going to be getting a UV dye from from an auto parts store and adding it to the system. You will be able to see the spot(s) it leaks out from with a black-light.

[fy469rtse]

I'm assuming at this point in time , it's a mess .
go pressure clean it , the run motor so pump pressure's up and watch for where it leaks, it could be something simple as a line that needs replacing, or pump, you didn't say where you thought it was leaking from, so photo's so we know what brand of pump you have

[XH29N0G]

I'm assuming at this point in time , it's a mess .
go pressure clean it , the run motor so pump pressure's up and watch for where it leaks, it could be something simple as a line that needs replacing, or pump, you didn't say where you thought it was leaking from, so photo's so we know what brand of pump you have

Actually, the car was just redone so it is quite clean.  This makes me a little more hesitant.  I will take a photo later (probably tomorrow but possibly later tonight) and post.

[tan top]

I'm assuming at this point in time , it's a mess .
go pressure clean it , the run motor so pump pressure's up and watch for where it leaks, it could be something simple as a line that needs replacing, or pump, you didn't say where you thought it was leaking from, so photo's so we know what brand of pump you have

Actually, the car was just redone so it is quite clean.  This makes me a little more hesitant.  I will take a photo later (probably tomorrow but possibly later tonight) and post.

[John_Kunkel]

The highest pressure in the system will occur with the wheels locked in either direction, have someone run the engine at a fast idle and hold the wheel hard in either direction and then look for a spraying/running leak (hose connections, valve on top of steering box, pump seal).

If it doesn't leak under high pressure I'd look at the pump reservoir seal (run you finger under the reservoir with engine off)

[XH29N0G]

Thanks so far. 

I have attached some pictures I just took.  The pump looks like a 1.06 model.  I have not yet had a chance to test it running and turning the wheel.  This may take a few days because of work tomorrow. 

There is a slow drip of power steering fluid off the bottom of the pump (first image - arrow and circle). 

The car has not been run since this morning and there is power steering fluid on the floor now.    I have not yet been able to figure out exactly where it is coming from (yet), but I wonder if the reservoir seal is indicated by the continued drips.


Any suggestions or recommendations for the next step will be greatly appreciated.

Thanks

[fy469rtse]

yep had that myself ,
reservoir seal to pump , get a new seal and pull the pump, , I almost gave up, but used a little rtv silicon with the new seal that did the trick

[375instroke]

That's pretty clean.  I usually Engine Brite and garden hose first, but that's so clean, I'd try brake cleaner and a rag.  Then run your hand around till you feel fluid.

[John_Kunkel]

For reservoir gasket leaks I've had great success with Lucas P/S additive, the gasket is actually a rubber O ring and the Lucas swells the dried out rubber to make it seal again.

[XH29N0G]

I have a suspicion that this is a new (or rebuilt) pump.  The car was recently restored, and have a foggy memory of a different shaped housing (like the 0.94 pump) when I dropped it off.  The folks who restored it are a few hours away so I think the trouble shooting and repair/replacement are mine to do.  I'll check the pump again tomorrow, and see if I can find the leak.  Right now I have to do some prep for work tomorrow.

[XH29N0G]

I had time today to locate the leak.  It comes out where the shaft that connects the drive pulley to the pump goes into the pump housing. 

It looks from the FSM like there is an oil seal, and I assume that is the source of the leak.

I do not have the specific tools listed in the FSM, but I have an assortment of pulley tools and seal pullers for working on UHV pumps at work.  I am inclined to try to replace the oil seal.  Can anyone tell me if this is a particularly finicky operation?  And if I am likely to run into any specific problems doing it without the factory tools?

[XH29N0G]

Can anyone point me to a place to buy the shaft seal for a federal stype PS pump? 

[el dub]

Just saw a commercial, Lucas power steering stop leak. Although it's not that hard to pull the unit.

[XH29N0G]

Just saw a commercial, Lucas power steering stop leak. Although it's not that hard to pull the unit.

I am planning to try that, but I am not holding my breath.  I thought I would ask about the shaft seal because I think that may end up being the thing that needs to be replaced. 

Alternatively, any advice on where to buy refurbished/replacement pumps and what to look for or avoid would also be appreciated.

Thanks.

[ws23rt]

Can anyone point me to a place to buy the shaft seal for a federal stype PS pump? 

You can find a seal at McMaster Carr---I use them a lot---Online catalog and very quick shipping are the tops.
You need to know the shaft diameter for the seal and the diameter of the bore that the seal presses into.
These dimensions you can get yourself but will need a caliper to measure them. Don't fret too much if your measurements are not dead on to the catalog dimensions. These are made in standard sizes.
If you don't have a dial caliper now and get one for this task you will soon wonder how you got so far in life without one

[Pete in NH]

Hi,

You can get complete seal kits for power steering pumps. Try Rockauto.com they list a Gates kit P/N 350410 for that pump. You'll need a puller for the pulley. Maybe you can rent or borrow one from the local auto parts place if you get the kit there. My local parts place used to lend me the puller. I would do all the can O rings as well as the front shaft seal. It's a relatively easy job doing PS steering pumps and many times you're better off redoing your pump than taking a chance on a half baked rebuilt from the local auto parts store.

[XH29N0G]

Thank you both.  I had not thought of McMaster Carr.  The P/N on the kit also helps.

[XH29N0G]

It took me a while.  I have the pump out, pulley removed, and now I am at the step where the seal is pulled.  The FSM says to use adapter SP-5323A and seal remover tool C-4062.  I have not been able to identify what these are. 

If I need them, can you point me to where I can get them.  If there is a work around, please point me in that direction. 

I am attaching two pictures below of the pump without the pulley.  It is leaking at the shaft seal at the shaft.  My concern is that this is a rebuilt pump so I am worried that the shaft has a burr or scratch.  When it comes to that, crocus cloth is recommended.  I also have questions about polishing.  Is crocus cloth a set grit (e.g., 1000)?  Is there a better way to polish the shaft if it has burrs or scratches?

Thanks

[Pete in NH]

Hi,

I've done several .94 pumps but never a 1.06 which is what you have. On the .94's you remove the reservoir can and disassemble the pump. You can then pry the front shaft seal out with a screw driver. I don't know if that would work on the 1.06 as well. From your photos the shaft looks pretty messy around the seal area and that's very likely why it is leaking. I would say you will have to disassemble the pump anyway to get that shaft out and polish it up. If you can not get a reasonably clean surface on that shaft the new seal will get chewed up and leak. You need to clean the shaft up so that any groove in it is less than a few thousandths at best. You really wont know if that shaft will clean up until you try. I'm surprised you say it is a recently installed rebuilt pump because that shaft isn't in too good condition. But then, many re builders hate to scrap a core and will rebuild just about anything and push it out the door. The special tools in the shop manual used to come from Miller Special Tools. I don't know if they are still in business. If they are it's a fair bet those tools are no longer available. If they are, a new pump would likely be less expensive.

[XH29N0G]

Thank you.  I managed to get the seal out with a regular seal puller.  The shaft does not look that good, but I am still cleaning it.  It also looks to me like the pump was assembled in a way that was meant to keep it assembled.  There is a lot of paint on the areas where there are o-ring seals the reservoir to the pump body.  I have the kit to rebuild it if necessary.  I am going to keep trying to clean the shaft without disassembling, but if that doesn't work, I will disassemble and see if the shaft can be cleaned up outside of the pump.

[XH29N0G]

Just an update.  So far so good on this one.  I polished the shaft using small pieces of oiled sand paper wrapped around it - 220 grit, then 600, then 800.  that I spun back and forth using a shoe lace that I wrapped around it.  This removed most of the pitting around the shaft and so far (I took the car for a drive after reassembling), I have not seen any leaks.