How do you remove a starter?

[1972DodgeChargerSE]

I recently got a 72 charger with a 1977 440 and the starter went bad. So, today I took the mounting bolts for the starter out but I can't get the starter through the header and it appears that in order to get the header out I need to remove the steering column or take the head off the engine or possibly both. Is there another way to get the headers out? If not is this because I have an engine/headers from a different car or did Dodge just design it to be a pain to remove the starter?

[NHCharger]

Most guys with BB's use mini starters when using headers. Have you checked to see if you remove the motor mount on the driver side and try jacking the motor up a bit?

[Mopar Nut]

First off welcome aboard!

Good luck, It took me a hour to replace mine, 69 383 with no headers. 45 mins of cussing 5 min to replace and 10 mins just to get up off the floor. I heard you can lift up the side of the motor and slid both header and starter out.

[cudaken]

I recently got a 72 charger with a 1977 440 and the starter went bad. So, today I took the mounting bolts for the starter out but I can't get the starter through the header and it appears that in order to get the header out I need to remove the steering column or take the head off the engine or possibly both. Is there another way to get the headers out? If not is this because I have an engine/headers from a different car or did Dodge just design it to be a pain to remove the starter?

While I cannot speak of your header combination here is how I do mine. Car is a 68 Road Runner 383 and Hookers.

1 Disconnect the drift pin that holds the steering column to the steering box.

2 Hook Vices Grips to the steering column (Chrysler has a special tool) and drive the column back into it self. It is designed to collapse on impact as a safety feature.

3 Unhook the battery from the battery terminals, not the starter!

4 Undo the starter bolts.

5 Use the main starter wire to pull the starter up through the headers.

I have done it this way on my 68 Road Runner and my 383 70 Cuda. I don't know the make of the headers on the Cuda, but they are not Hookers. Cuda shares the same inter-fenders as your 72 Charger.

I would buy the replacement starter and see if it will looks like it will fit if drop down through the headers. All so check with fellow 72 Charger owners and see if the 72 has the collapsible steering column. My 68 RR, 69 Charger and 70 Cuda does. Never owned a 72, but I bet it does! I will check my 72 shop manual later.

Bottom line, headers and BB suck when you have to change starter.

Cuda Ken    

[Cooter]

505 inch stroker in a dart with 2" primary tube headers....took 8 hours to remove the old Chrysler in three seperate pieces.
No this will not be a walk in the park especially if your on your back.

[green69rt]

69 440 charger with Hedman headers. Unbolt driver side motor mount,  Jack the engine to the passenger side.  Unbolt driver side header so it can move around.  Then starter came out with some effort.   After the third change out, I got it down to about a 4 hour chore.  Think about the mini.

[myk]

I thought that with headers and a BB the header and the starter, mini or otherwise, would have to go in or out as a unit?

[1972DodgeChargerSE]

Thanks for the replies, I did some research and it looks like 1972 chargers do have retractable steering columns so I think I am going to try kudaken's way since I think it will fit through the top of the headers. How do you get the column to retract after you disconnect it from the box do you just push it in and how do get it back out?

[1974dodgecharger]

First off welcome aboard!

Good luck, It took me a hour to replace mine, 69 383 with no headers. 45 mins of cussing 5 min to replace and 10 mins just to get up off the floor. I heard you can lift up the side of the motor and slid both header and starter out.

beat you by an hour took me 2 hours of playing tetris with mine and it had the mini starter in it from a 90s dakota.  After PM some fellow members their clock my steering full right turn and finally got it out then I forgot to get in it and checked my PMs again...damn hookers.

[cudaken]

72, you beat it back with a BFH (I use a 2 pound hammer). It will take some effort!

Cuda Ken

[Back N Black]

The steering column is 2 shafts so it retracts in case of an accident. There are plastic rivets that hold the inner and outer shaft together, once the rivets shear they must be replaced. The shaft will just telescope towards the firewall and the pot coupler  wil come apart. I would not break the plastic rivets.

[cudaken]

The steering column is 2 shafts so it retracts in case of an accident. There are plastic rivets that hold the inner and outer shaft together, once the rivets shear they must be replaced. The shaft will just telescope towards the firewall and the pot coupler will come apart. I would not break the plastic rivets.

Back In Black, what is a Pot Coupler? I used this trick for the first time say 25 years ago on my 68 Road Runner. I have still had no ill effect from it? I have owned her for 40 years now.

Cuda Ken

[1974dodgecharger]

The steering column is 2 shafts so it retracts in case of an accident. There are plastic rivets that hold the inner and outer shaft together, once the rivets shear they must be replaced. The shaft will just telescope towards the firewall and the pot coupler  wil come apart. I would not break the plastic rivets.

mine are busted I got slop in mine back and forth an inch or so....

is the pot coupler the one coupler just outside the firewall where you see the inner and outer connections of the steering column?  Its held on by like 3 screws I think...

[Back N Black]

The correct name is coupling body. The coupling body is held by a roll pin, but the shoes and shaft can seperate from the body.

[bill440rt]

TTI headers with a mini-starter on my '69. Had to remove the headers and the starter together. Suck a$$ job. 4hrs is about right.
Meanwhile, I've done the starter extraction with a regular H headpipe, it was much easier.

[Supercharged Riot]

I tried to remove he starter before removing my engine with headers. No luck!
I ended up removing the engine with the starter on it at same time

[myk]

Boy I can't wait to get them headers...

[cudaken]

 Sad thing about headers and most street Big Block motors. Headers are a waste of money! Now if you have stock log style that is a different story.  

Stock HP BB manifolds flow great! You can have them flowed (I forget the term where they run a abrasive stuff through them) and then even better HP.

Reason my Road Runner has them was at one time I raced her every weekend. 70 Cuda, well it had the headers when I bought her. 69 Charger, I kept the stock HP manifolds for the longest time. It was not till I added the GMC 6-71 that I went with header.

Changing Spark Plugs was a snap after I figured out to do it from under the car! Changing the starter? Took 45 minutes if that!

Only thing I do not like about Stock HP manifolds is how long it takes for them to cool down.

Cuda Ken  

[myk]

I was always under the impression that the effect of headers on a car had to do with the engine/drivetrain 'combo itself.  Such as, a stock motor would see a negligible difference between HP mani's and headers, however further from stock a car becomes more reactive to a 'mod like headers.

Besides, if it takes me $400-$500 to pick up a GOOD set of not-rusted out HP 440 mani's, I'd rather pony up the extra $200 or so and buy a new set of Doug's headers.  HOWEVER, I know that a car with HP mani's is well capable of turning out awesome power, and when it comes to starters and other repairs I WON'T be on my back for hours getting greased and torn up raw like a girl at the Bunny Ranch, so I guess I gots more thinking to do...

[Cooter]

Headers not only help hp and torque, but also help sound and fuel mileage.
Extrude honing a set of hp manifolds is not very cost prohibitive.
Headers all the way round (even on stock motor) give way better results over manifolds for the same money. Afterall, almost all newer cars have some form of steel TUBULAR exhaust on their stock engines.


Now they do suck for starter replacements. And in some cases, ground clearance.
Question is, is it worth it to you when the time comes for replacing starter. Aint like you have to do it every two weeks. You DO drive it that much though and the benefits outweigh the cons for me...

[1972DodgeChargerSE]

So I looked at it more and I would have to take out the steering box to get it out through the top of the headers so I am going to take it out by jacking up the engine when you do that do you jack up the drivers side and remove the header/starter through the hood or just use the jack to sloly lower the driver side of the engine to get the header/starter out? Also what type jack do you use?

[myk]

Now they do suck for starter replacements. And in some cases, ground clearance.
Question is, is it worth it to you when the time comes for replacing starter. Aint like you have to do it every two weeks. You DO drive it that much though and the benefits outweigh the cons for me...

Yyyyyessss....I DO drive it that much...

[Mopar Nut]

Stock HP BB manifolds flow great! You can have them flowed (I forget the term where they run a abrasive stuff through them) and then even better HP.
Cuda Ken  

  interesting idea, what about having them ceramic coated too?
Or I was going to ask TTi to custom bend a set of headers out of stainless steel.

[cudaken]

I was always under the impression that the effect of headers on a car had to do with the engine/drivetrain 'combo itself.  Such as, a stock motor would see a negligible difference between HP mani's and headers, however further from stock a car becomes more reactive to a 'mod like headers.

MKY, that is why I say most street engines. Most folks that hang out here are a little more hard core! Back in my day, God did I really type that  most street engines had headers, intake, distributor, coil, Yellow Spark Plug Wires and to big of a carb. 

With a stock cam, the HP Manifolds would have been fine. Yes, the headers would add maybe 5 HP over a stock HP Manifolds. But, on a street engine is it worth the 0.062 second in the quarter mile? Yes Cooter I know there is a lot of variables. Now for real racing? You need every 0.00 you can get. When you starter takes a shit? Hell No.

Cooter, yep tube style exhaust manifolds are hell of lot better than what was made in the 60's, 70's, 80's and 90's! Most of them where the log style. There maybe others but the HP BB Manifolds did not look or flow like any others that where on mass produced engines.

Far as header ping, well it sounds cool.      

Cuda Ken

[1972DodgeChargerSE]

Thanks for the help after pulling the steering column and some of the brake stuff out I was finally able to get the old starter out and the new one in and it starts right up now. But it turns out now my gas tank is bad, does any one have suggestions on what gas tank to get?