to re-body or not to re-body

[Zinc]

 
What if you sell it (or you eventually die and someone else sells it) to someone who pays a lot of extra money for its matching-numbers status?

And then the truth gets revealed later . . .


That buyer got ripped off. 

 

Hey Mike, you don't actually think that anyone who rationalizes that a rebody is "okay" to do, will worry about selling or even what happens after they drop dead, do you?   

If you guys are replying to me? I don't think you completely read my post? I rebodied a 318 car, using a 69 SE, using the 318 numbers, Ohhhhh! real valuable!, then cloned it into a 69 R/T sunroof car, (yes the SE was a sunroof car! ) I enjoyed the car for several years!, I was approached for a trade one day, a 71 Sat with a 440 transplant, rustfree beautiful car, He saw the 318 numbers on the dash, asked if it was cloned, I said cloned, and rebodied, he didn't care, the car was what he wanted, we traded, he happy, I'm happy, who cares! if he changes the numbers someday to make it a "legit" 69 R/T sunroof car, and some sap pays more than what a car should be worth, like P.T. Barnum said, "Theres a sucker born every", I know of a few rebodied cars that have sold, and resold over the years, at Carlisle and the Nationals, all the owners who never knew they had a rebodied car, we're all content and happy with their purchases, I've watch one particular car triple in value thru several owners!, they all enjoyed owning it, and making money off it!, it's just a car!,if your foolish enough to pay more than what it worth realisticly, or what you could build a clone for, your foolish for parting with your cash! when you bought your wife/ girl a diamond ring, you pay thru the nose like a fool for a "real" diamond, or a man made "zircona" diamond?,I bought the Zircona, She never knew! would buying a "real" diamond made a difference, NO!, samething with a rebody!, like the old saying,"what you don't know, Won't hurt you!"just tell yourself, it's just a car! with a bunch of numbers to assign to a buyer for identification, it's like your dog, who cares if he has "papers", or is a "mutt", you still love'em!, get over it! for Gods sake!

[Mike DC]

 
You're saying the seller's opinion of an object's value determines whether it's acceptable to rip off the buyer or not . . .



So by that logic,

If some guy didn't think a '69 Charger should be worth more than a '69 Chevy Nova, then he has the RIGHT to charge you the price of a '69 Charger and then deliver you a '69 Nova.

[JimShine]

Why even buy the zirconia? Give her a ring pop.

[rich4406bbl]

Zinc, I have just 2 questions for you. When you look in the mirror do think "Damn, I'm a shrewd guy!!" and how great did you feel when your girl was showing off her "diamond" ring to her friends and family bragging about how much coin you dropped on it? Remember the post you put up when YOU get taken for a ride one day. Don't go crying about being ripped off. Just remember your PT Barnum quote.

[Old Moparz]

If you guys are replying to me? I don't think you completely read my post? I rebodied a 318 car, using a 69 SE, using the 318 numbers, Ohhhhh! real valuable!, then cloned it into a 69 R/T sunroof car, (yes the SE was a sunroof car! ) I enjoyed the car for several years!, I was approached for a trade one day, a 71 Sat with a 440 transplant, rustfree beautiful car, He saw the 318 numbers on the dash, asked if it was cloned, I said cloned, and rebodied, he didn't care, the car was what he wanted, we traded, he happy, I'm happy, who cares! if he changes the numbers someday to make it a "legit" 69 R/T sunroof car, and some sap pays more than what a car should be worth, like P.T. Barnum said, "Theres a sucker born every", I know of a few rebodied cars that have sold, and resold over the years, at Carlisle and the Nationals, all the owners who never knew they had a rebodied car, we're all content and happy with their purchases, I've watch one particular car triple in value thru several owners!, they all enjoyed owning it, and making money off it!, it's just a car!,if your foolish enough to pay more than what it worth realisticly, or what you could build a clone for, your foolish for parting with your cash! when you bought your wife/ girl a diamond ring, you pay thru the nose like a fool for a "real" diamond, or a man made "zircona" diamond?,I bought the Zircona, She never knew! would buying a "real" diamond made a difference, NO!, samething with a rebody!, like the old saying,"what you don't know, Won't hurt you!"just tell yourself, it's just a car! with a bunch of numbers to assign to a buyer for identification, it's like your dog, who cares if he has "papers", or is a "mutt", you still love'em!, get over it! for Gods sake!

A 318 or a 426, it makes no difference. If you go into a bank with a gun & demand that the teller fills your bag with all cash, or to fill it with all the new pens they just ordered from the stationary supply store, it's still armed robbery. 

I know I won't change your opinion, but it's obvious where you stand on the issue of swapping VIN tags. Also, I see that by giving out fake diamonds to people who aren't even strangers to you, you just can't hold yourself back from deceit. There are a few people in the Mopar hobby that I will never buy a car from. One is a well known parts vendor that is well liked by a lot of people. He also has a decent reputation, but I have known him for close to 25 years & know that he has been called out on the legitimacy of a few, somewhat rare, cars back going back to the 1980's. I never was able to verify it, but where there is smoke there is fire.

I've owned cars that had paperwork issues in the past & "always" managed to straighten them out legally. Just this year, my '71 Barracuda had issues too. It has been off the road for years, & the last time anyone registered the car was 1985 in a different state according to the sticker on the windshield. Rodents destroyed the papers, so I needed 2 different bills of sale & forms, one to me from the seller, & one from the previous seller, a notarized affidavit, pencil tracing of the VIN, photos of the car, & extra forms to fill out. It took 2 attempts at the DMV office & almost 3 months to do all this, but I did & the car is in my name legally. I could have easily bought another VIN tag & title, but that's fraud.

[Ghoste]

If you take a turd and spray paint it with "real" gold leaf paint, is it still a turd?

[kylem4711]

If you take a turd and spray paint it with "real" gold leaf paint, is it still a turd?

nope, its a one of a kind custom.. ha

[Zinc]

Zinc, I have just 2 questions for you. When you look in the mirror do think "Damn, I'm a shrewd guy!!" and how great did you feel when your girl was showing off her "diamond" ring to her friends and family bragging about how much coin you dropped on it? Remember the post you put up when YOU get taken for a ride one day. Don't go crying about being ripped off. Just remember your PT Barnum quote.

#1 a Zircona Diamond is a real diamond, just  "man-made" in days, versus 10,000 plus years by mother nature!

#2 the witch is gone!, so wise investment!

#3 If you go thru life "niave", you'll get taken, If you don't wise up the first time, your a target all your life!

[Zinc]

Why even buy the zirconia? Give her a ring pop.

The "ring pop" is a good idea!, gets her in "training", if you know what I mean!

[Old Moparz]

Interesting thread on Moparts right now, a guy in Quebec gets away with all kinds of fraudulent crap & thrives from it.   

http://board.moparts.org/ubbthreads/showflat.php?Cat=0&Number=4309824&an=0&page=0&gonew=1#UNREAD

[Ghoste]

Interestingly, most of the people I've ever met who endorse deceit only feel that way about handing it out.  My experience has been that whenever they're on the receiving end rather than telling everyone that it's their own fault for being a niave fool, they usually get a hold of a lawyer or seek some other more twisted revenge.

[Paul G]

This thread is over two years old! Man does it have legs.

Tell me what the difference is between replacing half of the rotted sheet metal, installing all new accessories like pumps and motors, all new interior pieces, repaint and selling the car as a restoration. Or, moving the vin tag and the stamped ID panels from a rotted out car to a body in much better shape and then replacing all the accessory items and interior pieces, and selling the car as a restoration?

Ya, ya, one is legal one is not. IMO both are a fraud. Either way you do it the final product is the same. Neither car is original any longer. Truthfully, I don't see a difference between them. Both are just images of something that once was.

[Ghoste]

You're quite right Paul and I don't think it would be an issue if there weren't so many people trying to get full diamond prices for zirconium cars.

[charger01]

You're quite right Paul and I don't think it would be an issue if there weren't so many people trying to get full diamond prices for zirconium cars.

Very well said....

[Old Moparz]

You're quite right Paul and I don't think it would be an issue if there weren't so many people trying to get full diamond prices for zirconium cars.

Some people see a total rot box as a big challenge that can be restored no matter how bad the condition is. That's fine, as long as they either have the money to pay a restoration shop, or they can tackle the project themselves & don't have to pay someone to do it. I'm not in either position, since I don't have $50K or more to spend, nor do I have that kind of body work skill.

In the past it never made financial sense to do it because we could never resell the car & get back what was invested. It didn't usually matter because most people willing to restore an older car just did it because they loved the car. It's very different now, people are paying way more for a car than ever before. This brings out the scam artists & hacks that are in the hobby just for the cash.

The argument of what % of the car is left that makes the car worth restoring will vary. To me, when a car needs another entire car, I'll pass & use the better of the 2 & title that one, even with a state issued VIN. It's true that some vehicles are halpagged together & unsafe, but that will happen whether a car is legally titled or not, & should be inspected mechanically & structurally.

To have been ripped off by purchasing a legally titled, bondo buggy, sucks, but it can be avoided by inspecting the car, or having someone help with the inspection. To be ripped off by purchasing a car that has had it's VIN tag switched is worse, it's an act of deceit not incompetence. There area lot more good reasons to keep the switching of VIN tags illegal than not.