Wow, Someone is getting bold

[Steve P.]

Every company is at the same risk with patents. Was part of the downfall of Kodak..

Everything has a side effect. Can a person smoke TOO MUCH POT, I am sure they can, but according to everything I have been reading for the past year, there are zero deaths recorded that were due to overdose of pot. This cannot be said for any drug that was listed on a sheet I went batshit trying to read including ASPIRIN...

Chad: I see this as a RIGHT TO LIVE WITHOUT PAIN or LESS PAIN and for many a life worth living... Again, for your child dying of cancer. Are you NOT going to provide every possible thing you can for her wellness and pain??? THIS answers all doubt for me... ALL!!!!! I do not see another way to look at it.

EVERYTHING can be figured out. BUt NOTHING gets figured out if everyone fights anything new.

[polywideblock]

in regard to dope overdoses   http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_weed_related_deaths_are_there_each_year     check it out for your self

[Mike DC]

  
Keeping pot illegal ends up killing some people every year too.  Probably thousands in the drug trade and prison systems. 

And all those deaths are in addition to the people who still get killed more directly by smoking the drug.

[Steve P.]

Mike, who is dying smoking pot??  EVERY STUDY says just the opposite.. Even for people whom smoke 2 or more packs of cigarettes (AND pot) every day have a lower rate of cancer than those who smoke 2 packs of cigarettes per day!!!! These studies have been going on for many, many years. Even Nixon had these SAME RESULTS and threw them in the trash and started the drug war..... 43 years ago!!!!!! 

How many of just my family died in nonsensical pain from cancer?? Hundreds of thousands of dollars spent trying to cut it out and beat it. Non of my family ever did beat it. 

We all die.. Understandable and expected. That does not mean we have to live the last days, months and years of our lives in pain. Doesn't mean we should drain families of cash and homes. Doesn't mean we should have to remember our family members wishing they were dead.

All the studies from now and 40 plus years ago and even longer ago than that have all had the same results and they are that It does NOT CAUSE CANCER. No person in history has ever overdosed on POT. It has been proven to kill cancer cells of many types. It has also been proven to help with many types of stomach and intestinal issues...

I swear, if they said it would make the male member erect for 2 straight hours without failure it would be legal everywhere over night. If it fought gravity and gave older women back their younger HIGHER ,,, ummm, stature, it would be legal over night... But it has been SOLD TO US as a BAD BAD BAD DRUG...... Over and over for many years we have been told BAD DRUG. BAD PEOPLE USE THIS BAD DRUG.. This is not exactly true and the best info. that opposes the law today happens to be present and passed LAW ENFORCEMENT, Lawyers, Judges and DOCTORS.. 

Do I expect this to change over night? No. But I bring this to you as a group of like minded (for the most part), friends whom have a bit more trust and respect for others than just the street. Please spend a few minutes on the last link I put up..  What can it hurt?? And it won't cost you a thing....... 

[Chad L. Magee]

Chad: I see this as a RIGHT TO LIVE WITHOUT PAIN or LESS PAIN and for many a life worth living... Again, for your child dying of cancer. Are you NOT going to provide every possible thing you can for her wellness and pain??? THIS answers all doubt for me... ALL!!!!! I do not see another way to look at it.

If you go back and read my posts, you will see that I have no objection to real medical uses of said drug, just the legalization of it for non-medical uses.  There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.  That pretty much drops your point above...

The other thing is that I have no children, likely never to have children and do not ever see that even remotely being a possiblity in my lifetime.  That pretty much drops your point above again...

As for the issue of too many being housed in prisons for drug charges, there is another solution to the situation.  Rather than giving them jail time, they can be fined and forced to pay off the fine with time served doing duties for the good of the people (picking up trash, building houses for the poor, etc.) as well as rehab.  If they do not want to do that, then off to jail they go.  They make the decision which way they want to proceed in their life path.  One thing that you ned to remember:  Who twisted their arm to force them to take drugs in the first place?  They need to look in a mirror to see the guilty party.....

[F8-4life]

There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.

^^since people do it, there must be a reason.

[Chad L. Magee]

There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.

^^since people do it, there must be a reason.

People do dumb things for dumb reasons.  Just because they do it does not justify why they do it or need to do it....

[Steve P.]

AGAIN, " There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.  That pretty much drops your point above... "

It is not your or my or the governments business what you or I or the guy next door does with his or her own body. What do YOU care what I do??? and WHY would you care what I do??? Does it bother you that I drink beer?? (Bud light in case you invite me over).. lol...

You can say all the same about what brand of car you drive or what brand of sneakers you wear. It is not anyone's business what church or if a church or if I drink water from the tap or bottled!!! HOW IS IT POSSIBLE that we accept the government telling us we cannot do something that ONLY has an effect on our own person?? Especially when they KNOW it can be THE BEST MEDICINE against one of if not the #1 killer of people?

If it was proven that drinking water from my back yard garden hose would help in many ways against cancer, I would have one hell of a water bill.. People would come from every area of the WORLD to drink from my hose..   So should I CHARGE for the drinking from my hose or should I make it illegal to drink from any garden hose?? Or should we just be very happy that there IS something that will help and NOT HURT, (CHEMO). ONLY BIG MONEY could pull this brainwashing off....

To this day people kiss frogs due to a fairytale. Then we grow up and go to jail for another fairytale...

[Steve P.]

CHAD, do you exercise? Fire guns? Drink any kind of alcohol? Speed in your car? Go to church? Wear GREEN or BLUE? How about wheat bread? Any tattoo's? Own more than 1 car? Have a hobby? Listen to music loud? All of these are your choice. Some are for fun and some to increase hydrinolin to lift you even more. Welcome to getting high.... Yes, even church has been proven to make people feel high. It is a group rush. Just like watching a race. All are a choice and though at least one of these are illegal most of us do it rather often. ALL OUR CHOICE. Some are only a choice, but is still the same.. None of anyone's business if I like wheat bread!!


So to be completely clear. I want pot to be made legal.

While it was NOT legal, those busted can stay in jail as they broke the law. Just like street drag racing will cost you tickets and in some states, your car.

I find it most important to make it legal for those that need it as a medicine, though I firmly believe making pot illegal was strictly nothing less than corporate payday. On many levels.

Do you know that many times people are jailed for a joint longer than a child molester??? What kind of BS is that???   

[polywideblock]

that's what I've been saying all along ,what i ,you or anybody else does in their home behind closed doors(within reason) is their business . no one has the right to tell me what i can/can't do to my own body .why can't people these days just mind their own business? 

[Chad L. Magee]

No, I still do not want pot to be legal for non-medical purposes.  The bit about it not affecting anyone else is BS.  It does affect other people, reguardless if you see it or not.  You just can not take the fact that someone did not buy into your data sources.  When the sources are peer reviewed scientific journal articles to the level of Science or Nature, then show them to me and we will talk.  Anybody can endorse anything, but that does not automatically mean that it is true.  But, real scientific peer reviewed articles tend to weed out the non-truths pretty quickly.  The "high" I am talking about in the previous post involves using a chemical substance that you did not produce in vivo to influence brain chemistry.  Yes, you can get high off of other things that you mention (induced simulation of your sinaps), but those are not the same as the above ones, as they do not have the same long term effects on your brain and they are self induced reaction mechanisms....  

As for me, I spend most of my time either teaching or in my laboratory on research, rather than taking drugs to make me feel better.  I have no use for drugs, as I am fine without them.  My down time outside of chemistry is spent working on a solution to solve what Albert Einstein failed to finish before he died (relating magnetics and gravity forces together in one equation).  To most people my life is boring, but it is still my life and I make my choices to live the way I do because I am who I am.  But, it is my nature to follow rules.  To each their own, as long as it is legal....

[Steve P.]

Ok Chad. I will never FORCE you to get high. But if you want to give us your opinion you will also have to listen to ours.. It is only fair.

The scientific peer reviewed articles you want have been available for years. Now even the ones that NIXON ORDERED are available... I have read many such articles and don't understand half of what they say. I did not copy them or links to them. As I come across these in the future I will link them here as I did the LEAP links. But they all boil down to NOT being a terrible drug that will make you crazy, stupid, immoral or cause you to move on to a stronger drug. They did show medicinal use way back when Nixon wanted it to be like drinking acid. The reports even state that Nixon was furious when he read each universities results and threw the results of one in the garbage.

[polywideblock]

chad can i ask a question ,how do you feel when you solve that problem or equation that you've been working on for weeks /months. that same "rush" you get when you KNOW your right, is the same rush drugs/religion  driving at insane speeds etc give other people. 

[Chad L. Magee]

Steve P. - I have listened to your side, but it does not have the fact content that I look for when making a determination on issues.  I need specific articles in journals to look at, not vague references that they exist, to be able to see your side of the story using scientific data.  Until then, we are at an impass on this subject matter....

Polywideblock - Sorry, I do not get a rush in doing things like you say, never have had that since I was very little.  My brain is set up much differently than most people, as it acts more like a computer crunching numbers when I am in that particular work mode.  People have called me a "Sheldon" for that, along with my lack for need of human physical contact.  I also have the ability to concentrate on multiple problems at the same time with different approaches to each running concurringly when needed.  It just switches to a new problem at hand when I am done with the one I was working on, reguardless of the work load that is ongoing.  That even happens when I am in sleep mode as well (which can get annoying some times when you just want to relax).  I am not better than anyone else, just wired differently leading to special capabilities that I use regularly.  Drug use of any kind would just interfer with this process and lead to jobs not getting done, which I see is a waste on many levels.... 

[Steve P.]

Just got this from the LEAP site.. Lots of interesting things to consider here.

http://www.leap.cc/for-the-media/the-war-on-drugs-at-a-glance/ 

The numbers correlate to the list at the bottom...   

[F8-4life]

420!!!

[F8-4life]

There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.

^^since people do it, there must be a reason.

People do dumb things for dumb reasons.  Just because they do it does not justify why they do it or need to do it....

I think you trying determining what is "dumb" for another individual is an exact picture of dumb itself. (on your part)
One mans trash is anothers treasure?  Or in other words...One mans percieved dumb is anothers sound reason.
Or in other words your orginal statement cannot be said and if it is said with authority then your just plain wrong, on the grounds of not being able to think outside your own being.

[Chad L. Magee]

There is no real reason why someone healthy needs to get "high" on drugs to be happy in life.

^^since people do it, there must be a reason.

People do dumb things for dumb reasons.  Just because they do it does not justify why they do it or need to do it....

I think you trying determining what is "dumb" for another individual is an exact picture of dumb itself. (on your part)
One mans trash is anothers treasure?  Or in other words...One mans percieved dumb is anothers sound reason.
Or in other words your orginal statement cannot be said and if it is said with authority then your just plain wrong, on the grounds of not being able to think outside your own being.

No, it has been proven that there is a direct correlation that taking said drugs decreases your  brain's cognative abilities (especially short term memory functions), which leads to being less intellegent than you once were.  I stand by my earlier post.  You may think what I say is dumb, but that is just your own opinion.  Everyone is free to have their own opinion, whether it is right or wrong...

[F8-4life]

Yes I actually did know that about memory loss, by first-hand experimenting...hahaha 
but I could just as easily say the pros still outweigh the cons 10 to 1.
But In re-read my comment, I was actually commenting more on how people tend to not be aware of the whole picture but rather just there perspective. HUman nature at fault.

[Chad L. Magee]

Yes I actually did know that about memory loss, by first-hand experimenting...hahaha 
but I could just as easily say the pros still outweigh the cons 10 to 1.
But In re-read my comment, I was actually commenting more on how people tend to not be aware of the whole picture but rather just there perspective. HUman nature at fault.

But, I am aware of the whole picture when I make my conclusions on this subject.  People by human nature want to enjoy life and have fun doing so in various ways.  People take drugs for the emphoria that they feel, however it just masks a bigger problem down the road: addiction.  Few people just walk away from any drug without feeling the need to take it again for that same feeling, and yes, this includes dope.   Does that lead to concequences for their previous actions?  Yes, as they sometimes do not consider the effects until the damage is already done to them and others.  That is why people end up becoming Darwin award winners every day from their choices when they are on drugs with clouded judgements.  Being an outsider for most of my life, I get to watch the situations around me with a clear mind and see the raw facts.  You may claim that I am biased, but I look at the facts at hand....   

[Steve P.]

And as brilliant as you are, you continue to miss the fact that we only do have one life.. YOU, for you,, may not NEED any drugs. How wonderful for you!! Some of us live in pain every minute of every day. We take drugs to get through a day. I have taken more pain mads than I would ever care to think about and I will until I die. I know a few of the drugs I take are eating away at my liver.. I would rather be 100% perfect and need nothing. UNtil age 36 I was.

Years ago I smoked pot.. I NEVER GOT HOOKED. It did NOT lead to harder drugs. I also drank like a fish for 4 years in the service. Now I can take it or leave it. I have only ever been hooked on cars and women. And I STILL prefer thin women, so no SLIPPERY SLOPE there either!!

Yes Chad, everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but that does NOT mean your's is correct. It probably IS for you, but that does not mean it is for all..

For instance: You feel good and don't need or want drugs to get through your day.. It is not worth spending any brain matter in trade for getting through a day feeling somewhat better. I and I am sure all of us understand that.. BUT you are probably part of the 30% that makes it through life without a lot of pain. (I recently read that 70% of US men will experience light to severe back pain in their life). For me it is severe most of the time.  So why should I have to spend my ONE LIFE in pain?  I have described my wife's illness and it is the same for her. WHY should she go all through her ONE LIFE in pain?? ALL of the drugs we have ever been given have had something BAD that comes with it.. Why is it all those drugs are handed out like candy but POT will land you in jail with a record?

I do not have cancer. Not yet anyway!! But you can bet that I DO want to live and I want to be cancer free. If I am ever diagnoses with it I WILL be smoking pot and taking that chance of being busted and spending the rest of life in prison.. At least in prison I know for sure I will be able to get all the pot I need.....

[Chad L. Magee]

Steve P. - If you go back and reread my previous posts, you will see that I am not against legalizing the medical uses of said drug, just the other uses (excuses) that regular people have in taking it so they can feel "good" and cope with their lives.  Look, I did not have an easy life path, but I made a decision early on to make the best with what I had and not faulter in the path of my goals.  I have pain in my life as well, but I have learned to tolerate and accept it as proof of living.  Sure, I have stress in my life, but I work it out with research projects, exercise and other legal things that do not involve drugs.  This is the healthy way to releave stress in life...

Taking dope does not make you smarter or "fix" your problems, it causes brain damage over time (loss of cogenative processes).  Just because you can't remember your problems for a period of time does not mean that you have fixed them.  You are right in that we only have one life to live, so do you not think that people should reconsider what the concenquences are for taking drugs that cause damage like this?  You may not agree with my points, but they are based on facts....

[Steve P.]

Yes, you have facts. DRUGS ARE BAD. Tell me all the LEGAL drugs that are pumped into us every day by doctors and even over the counter that are WORSE. Have worse side effects. TONS of them end their warnings with DEATH. But NOT POT!!

Gasoline is harmful as hell to us, but we use it like monster junkies. We drink more beer in this country than any other. Loads of booze. Even over the counter stuff like CLARITIN says DEATH at the end of their warnings.  Hydrocodone, taken by millions every single day, eats your liver and messes with a few other things.  CHEMO... For Christs sake, CHEMO.. Nuclear waste pumped into the human body!!!!! PLEASE!!!!!!!  Used every day with the common BS LINE, What doesn't kill you only makes you stronger!!  Yeah, us and COCKROACHES!!! Again, all of these are legal. DIET SUGAR= ant poison, but packaged to make our daily lives better... (PLEASE)!!!

Pot is ILLEGAL ONLY because the pharmaceutical companies knew they could not control it and make money on it..  They know it's a tremendous cancer killer.. BUt they know they would lose their asses on every other drug they make a killing on.. It is pure greed and incredibly inhuman.

Here's another thing I recently learned.. People whom went into surgery for GASTRIC BYPASS that were diabetic have gotten over being diabetic. I am waiting for the study results, but from what I am hearing from a long time surgical nurse who is involved in many studies, this is a common result.  Why isn't this in the news???

I am going to draw this comparison once again.. BIG OIL owns us just as the drug companies do. BIG OIL is fighting everything that can cut their intake of cash just as the drug companies have conned our government to do to keep them in the money. And to cut our noses off to spite our faces, they tax us to do it!!!! 

[Fred]

Yes, you have facts. DRUGS ARE BAD. Tell me all the LEGAL drugs that are pumped into us every day by doctors and even over the counter that are WORSE. Have worse side effects.

I don't want to get in the middle of this but I need to point out............
                                        Even with the side effects............without them, some of us would be dead. For some of us it's very much necessary.

[Steve P.]

Thank you Fred.


I really am only trying to get people to open up and look at this for each person's self. We all deal with more crap than we would like to and that's bad enough. To know something can help but it could land you in prison with a record and a label is just plain wrong... The reasons they made it illegal is  load of crap and it's something that we all should be looking at to make a choice. This is FOR LIFE and QUALITY OF LIFE.